Schoolcraft v. The City Of New York et al

Filing 400

FILING ERROR - DUPLICATE DOCKET ENTRY - DECLARATION of NATHANIEL B. SMITH in Opposition re: 297 MOTION for Summary Judgment .. Document filed by Adrian Schoolcraft. (Attachments: # 1 Exhibit POX 36, # 2 Exhibit POX 37, # 3 Exhibit POX 38, # 4 Exhibit POX 39)(Smith, Nathaniel) Modified on 2/17/2015 (db).

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UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK

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ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT,
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PLAINTIFF,
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Case No.:
10CIV 6005(RWS)

-against5

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THE CITY OF NEW YORK, ET AL, DEPUTY CHIEF MICHAEL MARINO
TAX ID 873220, INDIVIDUALLY AND IN HIS OFFICIAL CAPACITY,
ASSISTANT CHIEF PATROL BOROUGH BROOKLYN NORTH, GERALD
NELSON, TAX ID 912370, INDIVIDUALLY AND IN HIS OFFICIAL
CAPACITY, DEPUTY INSPECTOR STEVEN MAURIELLO TAX ID 895117,
INDIVIDUALLY AND IN HIS OFFICIAL CAPACITY, CAPTAIN THEODORE
LAUTERBORN, TAX ID 897840, INDIVIDUALLY AND IN HIS OFFICIAL
CAPACITY, LIEUTENANT WILLIAM GOUGH, TAX ID 919124,
INDIVIDUALLY AND IN HIS OFFICIAL CAPACITY, SERGEANT
FREDERICK SAWYER, SHIELD NUMBER 2576, INDIVIDUALLY AND IN
HIS OFFICIAL CAPACITY, SERGEANT KURT DUNCAN, SHIELD 2483,
INDIVIDUALLY AND IN HIS OFFICIAL CAPACITY, LIEUTENANT
CHRISTOPHER BROSCHART TAX ID 915354, INDIVIDUALLY AND IN
HIS OFFICIAL CAPACITY, LIEUTENANT TIMOTHY CAUGHEY, TAX ID
885374, INDIVIDUALLY AND IN HIS OFFICIAL CAPACITY, SERGEANT
SHANTEL JAMES, SHIELD NO. 3004 AND PO'S JOHN DOE 1-50
INDIVIDUALLY AND IN THEIR OFFICIAL CAPACITIES, JAMAICA
HOSPITAL MEDICAL CENTER, DR. ISAK ISAKOV, INDIVIDUALLY AND
IN HIS OFFICIALLY CAPACITY, DR. LILIAN ALDANA-BERNIER,
INDIVIDUALLY AND IN HER OFFICIAL CAPACITY AND JAMAICA
HOSPITAL MEDICAL CENTER EMPLOYEES JOHN DOE 1-50
INDIVIDUALLY AND IN THEIR OFFICIAL CAPACITIES (THE NAME
.JOHN DOE BEING FICTITIOUS, AS THE TRUE NAMES ARE PRESENTLY
UNKNOWN),

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DEFENDANTS.
----------------------------------------------------------X

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DATE: June 5, 2014

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TIME: 10 : 16 A.M.

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(DEPOSITION OF JOSEPH FERRARA.)

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DIAMOND REPORTING

[phone]
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[e-mail]

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JOSEPH FERRARA
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through.

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Q.

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And you -- why were you assigned to the 81st

Precinct in February of 2009?

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MR. SMITH:

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A.

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received.

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Q.

Objection to form.

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As a result of the department charges that I

Were you told why you were being transferred to

the 81 Precinct?
A.

Officially, no, but I knew why because when IAB

when a member of IAB gets charges and specifications the

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higher-ups have an option of whether they want to transfer

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people out of Internal Affairs or keep them in Internal

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Affairs anyway and based on my history since March or April

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of 2007 I was chosen to be removed from Internal Affairs

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Bureau.

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Q.

And you said you weren't told this officially,

were you told this unofficially?
A.

Well, it's known that there's a very good

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kicked out of IAB, no one comes to you and says you got

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jammed up, so you're getting kicked out of IAB, they just

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come down with the orders that you're being transferred.

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So, the transfer is official, but the reason behind the

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likelihood that if you get jammed up in IAB that you get

transfer is not vocalized.

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Q.

And so, you said generally if you're brought up

DIAMOND REPORTING

[phone]
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[e-mail]

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JOSEPH FERRARA
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with charges and specs in IAB there's a good likelihood

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you'll be transferred?

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A.

50/50.

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Q.

And on what do you base that 50/50 number?

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A.

If you're liked or not liked.

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Q.

Let me just be a little bit more clear which is,

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how do you -- how did you come up with that number of 50/50

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chances you'll -- you'll stay in IAB as opposed to being

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transferred out?

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A.

Because I knew several people who got in trouble

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in IAB for misusing the computer or doing various other

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misconduct and were allowed to stay and then I knew people

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who weren't allowed to stay who did, you know, minor things

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of misconduct.

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Q.

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knew?

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

And how many people do you know who are in IAB

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So, that 50/50 number is based on people you

who were jammed up?

A.

I don't know.

I had given you a -- a list.

So

those are the people that I was aware of.
Q.

Okay.

So, that's what you're basing this number

on, is that list?

A.

Basically that list, yeah.

remember what was on that list.
DIAMOND REPORTING

[phone]
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I really don't

I just printed it out.
[e-mail]

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JOSEPH FERRARA
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But, yeah, basically it was on that list that I was -- you

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know, because I think I listed on that list people who were

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able to stay and people who were removed from Internal

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Affairs Bureau.

I.

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Q.

Well, we can -- we can go to that list.

I'm

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handing you what has already been marked as Defendants'

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Exhibit A.

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bottom NYC12142 through NYC12182.

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as you need to review that.

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A.

This is a document bearing Bates numbers at the
Please take as much time

Okay.

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MR. SMITH:

This is Exhibit A?

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MS. PUBLICKER METTHAM:

Yes.

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A.

Okay, I have the piece of paper.

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Q.

And it appears that you're looking at the list on

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NYC12182?

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

And this is the list of individuals that you knew

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from IAB who had gotten in trouble and on which you base

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your opinion that people are transferred out 50 percent of

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the time?

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

Okay.

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We'll come back to that.

Just to get the background and you received a
subpoena from me in this case; is that correct?
A.

Yes.

DIAMOND REPORTING

[phone]
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[e-mail]

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JOSEPH FERRARA
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Q.

And in response to my subpoena you sent an

envelope with multiple documents and a CD; is that correct?

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

The -- Exhibit A that I've just handed you, is

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that a complete list of the -- a set of the documents you

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provided to me?

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A.

I believe so.

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Q.

And as I mentioned, I added numbers to the bottom

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but they have

this is otherwise not been edited; is that

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correct?

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

Starting on the first page I just want to go

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through that to make sure that I understand your answers.

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Okay?

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A.

Okay.

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Q.

Now, on the left-hand side you've written some --

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some handwritten notes, correct?

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

So, by writing 2/18/10 and 4/1/10 next to

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paragraphs numbered 1 through 4, were you indicating that

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the only recordings you had responsive to those requests

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were the two recordings you provided on the CD?

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Yes.

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A.
Q.

So, aside from the CD provided, do you have any

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other recordings made by you of any NYPD employee regarding
DIAMOND REPORTING

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[e-mail]

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JOSEPH FERRARA
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misconduct or corruption?

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A.

No.

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Q.

Aside from the CD provided, do you have any other

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recordings made by you of any interactions on NYPD property

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regarding misconduct or corruption?

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A.

No.

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Q.

Aside from the CD provided, do you have any other

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recordings in your possession of any NYPD employee

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regarding any alleged misconduct or corruption?

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A.

No.

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Q.

And aside from the CD provided, do you have any

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other recordings in your possession of any interactions

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taking place on NYPD property regarding alleged misconduct

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or corruption?

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A.

No.

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Q.

Now, next to paragraph number 5 you've written

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e-mails.

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were the only documents responsive to that request?

Were you indicating that the e-mails you provided

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

So, aside from the documents provided, do you

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have any other documents in any form or format sent by you

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or to you with an attorney for Adrian Schoolcraft?
MR. SMITH:

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Objection to form.

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A.

Can you repeat that.

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Q.

Sure.

DIAMOND REPORTING

Aside from the e-mails and documents
[phone]
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[e-mail]

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JOSEPH FERRARA
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you've given me, do you have any other documents that were

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sent by you or given to you by an attorney for Adrian

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School?

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A.

No.
MR. SMITH:

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Q.

Objection to the form.

Now, looking at paragraph number 6 you've written

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n/a next to that.

By writing n/a were you indicating that

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you had no documents responsive to that request?

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

So, aside from the documents provided, do you

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have any other documents in any form or format of the

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corruption you saw during your 15 years on the job that you

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referenced in your e-mail to Jon Norinsberg on August 11,

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2010?

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A.

No, I don't have anything else.

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Q.

Moving on to paragraph 7.

You've written next to

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it n/a, precinct would have monthly activity reports and in

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parentheses paper.

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that you personally have no documents responsive to that

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request?

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

And moving now to paragraph 8.

By writing that were you indicating

You've written

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next to it precinct would have these records in

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parentheses, paper.

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personally had no documents responsive to that request?
DIAMOND REPORTING

Were you indicating that you

[phone]
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[e-mail]

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JOSEPH FERRARA
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A.

Yes.

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Q.

And I'm sorry, I also note that underneath that

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you've written audio 2/18/10, thirty-nine minute mark or

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thirty-nine minute.

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that recording, the 2/18/10 recording has something

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responsive to this request?

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A.

Were you indicating that you believe

No, I just -- I think that had to do with -- I

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think it had to do with when they were talking about weekly

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breakdowns that it was mentioned on the audiotape that I

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provided to the law department and at that -- timewise,

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that's where the reference was made.

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Q.

Okay.

When did you begin recording your

co-workers?

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A.

February 18, 2010.

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Q.

Did anyone suggest that you record your

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co-workers?

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A.

No.

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Q.

Why did you continue recording your co-workers?

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A.

I didn't feel in my opinion that the way Police

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Officer Schoolcraft was being regarded to in the precinct

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was appropriate by the commanding officer.

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MS. PUBLICKER METTHAM:

All right.

We're

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going to take a short break so that we can change
the videotape.

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the record.
DIAMOND REPORTING

So, we're just going to go off

[phone]
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[e-mail]

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JOSEPH FERRARA
THE VIDEOGRAPHER:

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We are now -- excuse me.

We are now off the record at 11:23 am.

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(Whereupon, a short recess was taken.)

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THE VIDEOGRAPHER:

This is tape two of the

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deposition of Joseph Ferrera.

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record at 11:40 a.m.

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Q.

Okay.

We are now on the

So, before we took the break you stated

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that you started recording because you didn't like the way

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that Schoolcraft was -- was treated by Mauriello in the

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precinct; is that correct?

A.

The way Mauriello
MR. KRETZ:

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A.

Objection.

Sorry.

The way Mauriello was referring to Schoolcraft in

the precinct.
Q.

And how was Inspector Mauriello referring to

Schoolcraft in the precinct?

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A.

That he was a rat.

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Q.

Did you think at the time you started making

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these recordings that you would be suing the City at some

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point?

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MR. SMITH:

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MS. PUBLICKER METTHAM:

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THE COURT REPORTER:

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I'm sorry, the who?
City.

At the time you were

making these recordings -MR. SMITH:
DIAMOND REPORTING

Did you think that you --

[phone]
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[e-mail]

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JOSEPH FERRARA
MS. PUBLICKER METTHAM:

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You would be suing

~.. .

the City at some point.

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You meaning the witness?

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MR. SMITH:

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MS. PUBLICKER METTHAM:

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MR. SMITH:

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MS. PUBLICKER METTHAM:

Objection to form.
Is there another

definition of you that I'm not aware of?

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MR. SMITH:

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suing.

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There's another definition of

Are you referring to the witness suing

the City?
MS. PUBLICKER METTHAM:

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Yes, it's quite

plain from the question, Mr. Smith.

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Yes.

Q.

So, Mr. Ferrera, when you made these recordings,

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did you think that you would be suing the City at some

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later date?

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A.

No.

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Q.

How many recordings did you make of your

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co-workers at the NYPD?

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A.

Two.

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Q.

Only two?

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

And you provided all the recordings you've ever

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made of your co-workers to the City of New York?

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

How did you choose what to record?

DIAMOND REPORTING

[phone]
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[e-mail]

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JOSEPH FERRARA
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A.

I chose the commanding officers' meeting to

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record on those two instances.

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Q.

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meeting?

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Why did you choose the commanding officers'

A.

Because that's where Deputy Inspector Mauriello

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was able to speak somewhat freely because that meeting

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consisted of all the supervisors of the precinct, there was

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no -- there was no one lower than a sergeant present at

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those meetings.

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Q.

And why did you choose only February 18th and

April 1st of 2010 to record?
Those were the two meetings, I believe, that were

A.

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back to back for the COs' meetings under February 18th was

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the next meeting after I had heard in a previous CO meeting

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him refer to -- Inspector Mauriello refer to Schoolcraft as

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a rat.

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recording.

So that very next meeting is when I started

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Q.

Did you save every recording you made?

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

Did you delete any recordings?

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A.

No.

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Q.

Have you provided to anyone else a recording of

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the NYPD that you have not provided to me?

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A.

No.

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Q.

Did any of your co-workers know that you were

DIAMOND REPORTING

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[e-mail]

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JOSEPH FERRARA

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and they started the training, the officers -- the training

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sergeant would leave -- let's say hypothetically it was an

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in-term order, he'd have copies of the in-term orders in

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the -- where roll call was done.

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later and get a copy of that in-term order and you know,

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read it themselves.

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there was anything wrong with that.

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Q.

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So an officer can come by

So I didn't feel based on that that

correct?

You were a -- a sergeant on patrol at some point,

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

Did you ever discuss new in-term orders or new

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policies with officers under your command when you were a

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sergeant on patrol?

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A.

Not on patrol, no.

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Q.

And why not?

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A.

Because they had the training sergeant, he does

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that.

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Q.

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As a member of the NYPD, are you required to

report misconduct that you personally observe?

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A.

You are, yes.

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Q.

In -- going back to your e-mail from August 11th,

Official misconduct.

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you stated that downgrading crime reports this happens

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everywhere.

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

What did you mean by this happens everywhere?

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DIAMOND REPORTING

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JOSEPH FERRARA
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A.

All the commands do that.

When there's a report

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taken for a specific crime, the -- the usual course is that

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that complaint gets taken by the officer on patrol, it gets

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handed into the desk officer to be signed off on.

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put into the computer and it goes up to what's called crime

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analysis.

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detective squad.

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needs to be investigated.

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of ComStat, commanding officers were being looked at as far

It gets

Depending on the crime it gets referred to the
If it's something that's still open it
Because of ComStat, as a result

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as their numbers in regards to seven major crimes and they

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were looked at unfavorably if they had a spike in seven

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major crimes.

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So, it started to be done where a commanding

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officer would tell the crime analysis people who were

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supposed to put together the 61s and even the desk officers

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at some point call up the complainant and let's go back

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over what the complainant says in regards to their

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allegation, let's see if it really is a robbery.

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if they really got their car stolen.

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was hit with a pipe for real, how do they know they were

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hit with an object, how do they know it wasn't a fist.

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That's in order to reduce the complaint for that category,

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because if the complainant says well, I thought it was a

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bat or I thought it was a pipe, and this person says to the

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complainant well, are you sure and they turn around and say
DIAMOND REPORTING

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Let's see

Let's see if somebody

[e-mail]

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JOSEPH FERRARA
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well, no, I'm not sure, then it could have been a fist;

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yeah, it could have been a fist.

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assault two which is a seven major felony down to an

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assault three which is playing with numbers.

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the original complaint -- if the officer who took the

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report out in the street listens to the complainant and

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complainant says I got hit with a pipe, the officer is

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going to write complainant states he got hit with a pipe.

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We're going on what the complainant says out in the street

Now that changes from an

Because if

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because that's what the cops are trained to do.

Now, later

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on we want to -- we want to -- oh, we don't want another

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felony assault, so -- in that area especially, if it

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happened in a certain area that wasn't conducive to -- to,

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you know, to the CO.

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made and then reports would be changed.

So then these phone calls would be

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Q.

How many times did you see reports changed?

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A.

I didn't personally see reports changed.

I know

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the process was done by talking to people, but I never

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saw -- I was never asked to call anybody back to

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re-interview anybody.

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Q.

Did you ever downgrade any crime complaints?

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A.

No.

23

Q.

And you were never asked by a supervisor to

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downgrade any crime complaints?
A.

No.

DIAMOND REPORTING

(718)

624-7200

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[e-mail]

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JOSEPH FERRARA
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Q.

Have you ever attended ComStat?

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A.

Once.

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Q.

And when was that?

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A.

I think it was when I was in the 40 Precinct, I

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think.

6

Q.

Why did you attend ComStat at that time?

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A.

The CO wanted sergeants to get a feel of what

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ComStat was like.

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Q.

Did you have to speak at ComStat?

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A.

No.

Actually, you know what, I went to ComStat

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more than -- well, I went to TrafficStat, I went to ComStat

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just to get a feel of what it was like, but I went to

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TrafficStat I believe twice when I was a sergeant in the 40

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when I was

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16

Q.

~ssistant

!CO.

Have you ever worked in a supervisory position

before ComStat came to the NYPD?

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A.

No.

18

Q.

Would it be appropriate for an officer on the

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street to ask a victim are you sure it was a bat or a pipe?

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A.

No.

21

Q.

You don't believe it would be appropriate for an

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officer on the street to ask questions?
A.

Appropriate, yes, but does it happen, no, because

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the radios are so busy in these commands, the officer wants

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to take the report, give whatever kind of aid is needed and
DIAMOND REPORTING

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[e-mail]

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JOSEPH FERRARA
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go to the next job, because there's pressure from the COs

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in regards to response time, for how long does it take a

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·;

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cop to get to another job.

Q.

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But if an officer did ask a victim on the scene

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are you sure it was a pipe or a bat, do you believe that

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would be an inappropriate question?

7

A.

No, that would be appropriate.

8

Q.

So, your -- your problem with this is

9

is

calling later?

A.

10

Yes.

The NYPD teaches its officers to interact

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with the community on various different levels and if an

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officer goes to a job and the person says they got hit with

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a bat and robbed, they got hit with a bat and robbed and

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the officer puts that down.

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there would be further questions in regards to that

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complaint.

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really departmentallywise is that that will go to the squad

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and a detective assigned to that case would investigate

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that crime.

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21

Q.

I don't know why later on

The only further question in my feeling and

Who do you believe was responsible for this

downgrading of crime complaints?

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MR. SMITH:

Objection to form.

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MR. KRETZ:

Objection.

A.

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\0
·.

'"·--

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Who actually did it or who gave the orders to do

it?
DIAMOND REPORTING

[phone]
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[e-mail]

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JOSEPH FERRARA
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Q.

Both.

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A.

Well, I believe it -- it -- it fell on crime

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analysis people because they worked hand in hand with the

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commanding officer in -- because crime analysis put

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together all the complaints into a system and was able to

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tally all the crimes up for the seven majors.

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worked hand in hand with the CO in all the precincts that's

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the way it was.

So they

In the 81 precinct it would be DI Mauriello, you

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know, giving the orders to look at certain crimes.

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would even say it at the -- at roll calls or COs' meetings

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that the desk officers have to start looking at special

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complaint reports that come in because the desk officer is

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supposed to review the complaint reports, but it went on in

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the -- in the 103.

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just a general practice for commanding officers to try to

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limit the amount of numbers that they have because the way

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the job is if a CO has a rise in numbers and they want to

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get promoted that will stop them from getting promoted.

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23

Q.

He

It went on in the -- in the 40.

It was

Do you believe that this downgrading of crime

complaints was official misconduct?
A.

I don't know if it was official misconduct.

I

felt it was misconduct.

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Q.

Did you ever report this misconduct to anyone?

25

A.

No.

DIAMOND REPORTING

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[e-mail]

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JOSEPH FERRARA
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Q.

Why not?

2

A.

Because if you -- if you go around reporting

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stuff about your fellow workers or your commanding officer

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then chances are you're going to get yourself jammed up

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because there's -- there's that -- there's a perception in

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the NYPD to punish people who try to do good stuff

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sometimes.

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making any kind of enemies with anybody or -- you know, I

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was trying to just keep myself out of trouble and do the

10
11

So, I wasn't looking to get myself jammed up by

right thing like I'm supposed to do.
Q.

And you believe that this quote, unquote numbers

12

game happened because Commissioner Kelly and the commanding

13

officers wanted to see crime go down, right?

14
15

MR. SMITH:

MR. SMITH:

A.

question?
THE WITNESS:

18
19

What was the answer to that

Yes.

16
17

Objection to form.

Q.

Yes.

Now, again, in your -- in your e-mail to

20

Mr. Norinsberg from August 11th you stated that cops are

21

also directed to write certain moving summonses, they're

22

frowned upon if they issue a brake light, taillight,

23

headlight summons, the cops have to write seat belt, cell

24

phone summonses

25

A.

Yes.

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Q.

-- do you recall that?

2

A.

Uh-huh.

3

Q.

So, the supervisors didn't want officers to come

4

in with just any kind of summons?

5

A.

Yes.

6

Q.

Do you know why?

7

A.

There's numbers with that, too.

The --the

8

executive officer of a command was in charge of traffic

9

conditions in the command.

The CO was in charge of crimes

10

in the command and he goes to ComStat.

The XO is in charge

11

of traffic conditions in the command and he goes to

12

TrafficStat.

13

So, the XO wanted to make sure that his numbers

14

looked good or better than last year's numbers in regards

15

to seat belts, cell phone summonses, because another part

16

of TrafficStat is accidents.

17

number of injuries and there was pressure on the XOs from

18

the chief of traffic to reduce accidents, to reduce

19

injuries and to increase summonses because they felt if we

20

gave out more summonses for cell phones and for seat belts,

21

less people would get injured, there would be less

22

accidents.

The number of accidents, the

23
24
··'

·~

In the -- in the 81 specifically on one of those
tapes Captain Perez who was the XO at the time has a whole

25

big thing about how he doesn't care, he wants his number.
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JOSEPH FERRARA
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They even had started in the 81 which I had never seen

2

before, they would make the supervisors on patrol document

3

as the patrol officers came in at the end of their tour

4

what did you write today, day by day, how many did you

5

write, what did you write.

6

7

Q.

And that was in reference to these seat belts and

cell phones?

8

A.

Yes.

9

Q.

Do you believe there was a quota policy in the

10
11

81st Precinct?

A.

No,

I don't believe there was a quota, because

12

there was never a number set in stone, but there was

13

tremendous pressure put on officers to answer the radios,

14

write complaints, take care of people who needed, you know,

15

aid with hospitals and stuff, help with lost kids, help

16

finding people.

17

summonses throughout their day.

18

numbers from those officers.

19

officer answered 15 different jobs that day and didn't get

20

a meal, how many summonses did you write that day.

21

Q.

But then they also had pressure to write
They wanted to see those

And they didn't care if the

Did you believe there was a quota policy in the

22

81st Precinct requiring officers to issue a certain number

23

of UF-250s?

24
•

\

.I

'0

25

MR. SMITH:

A.

Objection to form.

There was never a set number, but there was

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JOSEPH FERRARA
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tremendous pressure for that, also, because that ended up

2

being statistic at ComStat number of 250s that were done.

\

3

4

Q.

But there was never a number of UF-250s that

officers in the 81st Precinct were required to issue?

5

A.

No.

6

Q.

Have you ever issued a UF-250 without reasonable

7

Not a set number, no.

suspicion?

8

A.

No.

9

Q.

Did any supervisor ever tell you to stop someone

10

even if you did not have reasonable suspicion?

11

A.

No.

12

Q.

Have you personally observed another officer stop

13

someone without reasonable suspicion?

14

A.

No.

15

Q.

Did you ever lose overtime for failing to issue a

16

certain number of UF-250s?

17

A.

No.

18

Q.

Did you ever suffer a change

19

~f

tours as a result

of failing to issue a certain number of UF-250s?

20

A.

No.

21

Q.

Were you ever denied vacation days as a result

22

failing to issue a certain number of UF-250s?

23

A.

No.

24

Q.

Was there a quota policy regarding the number of

25

summonses officers in the 81st Precinct were required to

r

~

I
!
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JOSEPH FERRARA
1

issue?

"•J
..•J

MR. SMITH:

2

3

A.

Objection to form.

Not a specific number per officer, but I believe

4

Captain Perez makes reference to a certain number that he

5

wanted for a tour.

6

7

Q.

When you say for a tour, does that mean for the

whole squad?

8

A.

For that platoon.

9

Q.

For that platoon, I'm sorry?

10

A.

Yeah, a platoon would consist of two squads

11

usually working, so.

12

-- hypothetically, I need five cell summons today, cell

13

phone summonses from third platoon.

14

Q.

15

Precinct?

16

A.

He would turn around and say I need

And when did Perez become the XO of the 81st

I really don't remember.

When I got there in --

17

when I got there in 2009 I don't believe he was there yet.

18

Somebody else was there.

19

I think Perez came in after.

20

got there.

21

Q.

He left to go somewhere else and
I'm really not sure when he

So, if I told you that Captain Lauterborn was the

22

XO prior to Captain Perez, would that refresh your

23

recollection?

24

. .....
"·!)/
\-.~-·~·

25

A.

Yeah, I remember Captain Lauterborn, yes, I just

don't remember the dates.
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JOSEPH FERRARA
1

2

Q.

Did you ever hear Captain Lauterborn give a quota

for summonses to officers in the 81st Precinct?

3

A.

No.

4

Q.

And you said that Captain Perez gave a number of

5
6

five summonses per platoon?

A.

Not every day.

I mean it depended on the day

7

what he needed, you know, because he would keep track of

8

his numbers on a daily basis platoon by platoon.

9

felt like oh, I had ten seat belt summonses last year this

So if he

10

day I need ten today, you know, so it would vary as to what

11

he wanted.

12
13
14

Q.

And when Captain Perez discussed summonses, was

he discussing As, Bs and Cs?

A.

No, he was strictly concerned with B summonses,

15

because that -- B summonses have to do with moving

16

violations which impact traffic conditions.

17

Q.

So, did you ever hear Captain Perez talk about a

18

specific number of C summonses that he wanted the platoon

19

to issue?

20

A.

No, no.

21

Q.

Have you ever issued a summons without probable

22

cause?

23

A.

No.

24

Q.

Did anyone ever tell you to issue a summons if

25

you did not have probable cause?
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JOSEPH FERRARA
1

A.

No.

2

Q.

Have you ever personally observed another officer

3

issue you a summons without probable cause?

4

A.

No.

5

Q.

Did you ever lose overtime for failing to issue a

6

certain number of summonses?

7

A.

No.

8

Q.

Have you ever suffered a change of tour as a

9

result of failing to issue a certain number of summonses?

10

A.

No.

11

Q.

Have you ever been denied vacation days as a

12

result of failing to issue a certain number of summonses?

13

A.

No.

14

Q.

When you said that Captain Perez had this goal

15

of, for example, five seat belts on -- on a platoon, was

16

there ever any punishment if the platoon was not able to

17

reach that number?
MR. SMITH:

18
19

A.

Objection to form.

Not that I'm aware of, but he would get very

20

irate with the supervisors and come down on supervisors,

21

but I don't know if any actual punishment was ever mended

22

out.

23
24
\

<:J

25

Q.

Did you ever see any police officers get punished

for failing to bring in summonses for Captain Perez?
A.

No.

DIAMOND REPORTING

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JOSEPH FERRARA
.

)

1

2

Q.

Was there a quota policy in the 81st Precinct

requiring officers to issue a certain number of arrests?
MR. SMITH:

3

Objection to form.

4

A.

Yes.

5

Q.

And what -- what is a quota to you?

6

A.

A set number that had to be seen by the

7
8

commanding officer during a specific period of time.
Q.

9
10

And what was -- I'm sorry, strike that.
How many arrests were officers in the 8lst

Precinct required to make under this quota?

11

A.

At least one.

12

Q.

Per what period of time?

13

A.

I don't remember if it was quarterly or if it was

14

for the year, because I know they used to run the officers

15

for the COs' meetings to see who had zero arrests still and

16

Mauriello would talk to that squad sergeant and say hey,

17

Jones doesn't have an arrest yet, why and they would, you

18

know, question the sergeant as to why the person doesn't

19

have an arrest, the officer.

20
21
22

Q.

But you can't recall if it was one per quarter or

one per year?
A.

No, it used to be one per year and then I think

23

it got knocked to down to maybe one a quarter.

24

summons activity used to be monthly, you know, officers

25

would do a monthly activity report and that was it.
DIAMOND REPORTING

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'Cause a

In the

[e-mail]

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JOSEPH FERRARA
1

81 Precinct it was down to daily, that they were taking

2

activity reports from officers on a daily basis there.

3

4
5

Q.

Who told you that officers at the 81st Precinct

were required to make one arrest per year or per quarter?
A.

Mauriello said it -MR. SMITH:

6

9

You can

answer.

7

8

Objection to form.

A.

Mauriello said it at the COs' meetings, he wanted

every officer to have at least one arrest and that came

10

from the borough, he says it came from the borough because

11

the borough runs the officers, they don't want to see

12

anybody with no arrests.

13

Q.

When were you told this?

14

A.

Various different times in the 81 Precinct.

15

Q.

When was the first time you were told at the 81?

16

A.

Probably the first COs' meeting I went to which

17

had to be sometime after I got there, which sometime in

18

'09.

19

20

Q.

Have you ever made an arrest without probable

cause?

21

A.

No.

22

Q.

Were you ever told to arrest someone even if you

23

didn't have probable cause?

24

A.

No.

25

Q.

Did Inspector Mauriello ever tell officers that

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JOSEPH FERRARA

i
\

·1

1

A.

No.

l

2
3

MR. SMITH:
Q.

Objection to form.

Is there any other misconduct in the 81st·

4

Precinct that you are aware of that you have not yet

5

testified to today?

6

MR. SMITH:

Objection to form.

7

A.

No.

8

Q.

Is there anything else relating to this lawsuit

9
10

that you haven't testified to that you would like to add
now?

11

12

MR. SMITH:

A.

Objection to form.

Just that, you know, commanding officers

13

shouldn't go around labeling cops that report allegations

14

as rats, that)s just retaliatory, it -- it causes other

15

supervisors to look at that officer in a different view and

16

they take actions against those officers based on that

17

perception.

18

should be spoken about by a CO. If the CO feels that way,

19

the CO should just keep it to himself and -- I mean, the

20

officer who is reporting an allegation of corruption or

21

misconduct has a right to do so confidentially which is

22

where IAB messed up because it got out, apparently, that

23

that Schoolcraft called up IAB and that's something that

24

that shouldn't have -- that's not supposed to happen in

25

IAB.

I don't believe that that's something that

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JOSEPH FERRARA
If a person reports something, especially

1

........

)

·

2

uniformed member of the service, if you're reporting

3

something against another uniformed member of the service,

4

that's supposed to remain confidential because right away

5

now you're going to have, you know, tension between the

6

officer who reported and -- and the -- you know, the

7

subject.

8

don't report things in the NYPD any quicker is because of

9

experiences like this, situations like this.

10

11

Q.

That's just not a fair tactic, it's why people

How do you know that someone in IAB was the one

who leaked Adrian Schoolcraft's name?

12

A.

People were talking in the command.

13

Q.

And what did they say?

14

A.

Apparently IAB, I think, called up the TS,

15

telephone switchboard operator, and left a message for

16

Schoolcraft to call back or something, that doesn't

17

normally happen.

18

what I, you know, remember being, you know, overhearing.

19
20
21

Q.

That's what I think, you know, that's

So, when individuals are called to IAB for a PG

hearing, how are they normally notified?

A.

I believe the ICO gets the phone call to notify

22

the subject in the precinct that they got to show up for a

23

PG hearing.

24
'

J

~

Q.

And on what do you base that opinion?

25

A.

My experience being in ICO's office when I was 41

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JOSEPH FERRARA
1

40 Precinct.

2

Q.

3
4

So, when you were a desk sergeant or a lieutenant

on the desk, you never got a call from IAB?
A.

I don't -- I don't believe so.

No.

And when I

5

was in IAB as a sergeant and a lieutenant the ICOs are the

6

ones we notified when we needed somebody to come down for a

7

PG hearing.

8

person's command and say, hey, listen, this is IAB, we need

9

Joe Blow to come down to talk to us, it wasn't like that,

10

We didn't notify -- we didn't call the

that's not confidential.

11

An ICO is supposed to remain confidential, that's

12

what their duties and responsibilities are, is they're not

13

supposed to broadcast to other members of the command hey,

14

Joe Blow got a PG hear

15

PG hearing, that's one of their specific duties, is that

16

they remain confidential with information that they

17

possess.

18

Q.

19

a notification to come down for a

So, it's your belief that IAB does not call the

regular telephone switchboard to schedule PGs of officers

20
21

A.

Absolutely.

22

Q.

-- regardless of whether they're subject or

23

witness officer?

24

<)

A.

Yes.

25

Q.

And so, it's your understanding based on what you

DIAMOND REPORTING

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JOSEPH FERRARA
1
\.

overheard that IAB leaked Schoolcraft's name by leaving a

2

message in the switchboard for Adrian Schoolcraft?

I

3

A.

Yes.

4

Q.

Is it your understanding that anyone from IAB

5

purposefully leaked his name?

6

A.

No, I don't know.

7

Q.

And when did you first hear about Adrian

8

Schoolcraft's name being linked with IAB?

9

A.

I don't recall.

10

Q.

Was it before October 31, 2009?
MR. SMITH:

11

Objection to form.

12

A.

I really don't remember when.

13

Q.

Was it before your surgery?

14

A.

Maybe, because I was out for a while after that

15

and Schoolcraft's name wasn't really coming up after I came

16

back to work, so it probably was before the surgery.

17

Q.

Was there any other conversations you overheard

18

about Adrian Schoolcraft in the precinct that you have not

19

testified to already?

20

A.

No.

21

MR. SMITH:

Objection to form.

22

A.

No.

23

Q.

Did Captain Monteleone ever call you a rat?

24

A.

No, I don't believe so.

25

Q.

Is the testimony you've given here today complete

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JOSEPH FERRARA
1

and accurate?

'\

2
3

MR. SMITH:
A.

Objection to form.

Yes.

4

MS. PUBLICKER METTHAM:

5

Mr. Ferrera.

6

Thank you,

time.

I have no further questions at this

MR. KRETZ:

7

8

EXAMINATION BY

9

I have some questions.

MR. KRETZ:

10

Q.

Mr. Ferrera, hi.

I'm Walter Kretz representing

11

Steven Mauriello.

12

your time at the 81st Precinct.

13

I'd like to get the timeline straight on

Directing your attention to Exhibit A page

14

stamped 12145 which is an e-mail, apparently, that you

15

wrote to Mr. Norinsberg in August of 2010.

16

A.

Okay.

17

Q.

In the second -- the third to last paragraph you

18

indicate that I got jammed up in April 2009 and transferred

19

to 81 Precinct.

20

when you went to 81 Precinct?

Does that refresh your recollection as to

21

Yes.

22

Q.

Was it in April of 2009?

23

A.

Yes.

24

\ ..J

A.

Q.

Just to make certain, directing your attention to

25

page, in Exhibit A, 12174 and 175.

DIAMOND REPORTING

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JOSEPH FERRARA
1

Q.

Hello, Mr. Ferrera, how are you?

2

A.

Good.

3

Q.

I'm going to ask you a few more questions.

Thank you.
I

4

know it's been a long day.

5

question, the way I ask it, it's not clear, let me know and

6

I'll try and rephrase it, okay?

7

A.

Yes.

8

Q.

If there's anything about the

All right, great.
You were asked questions earlier about the two

9

10

recordings that you made at the 81 CO meetings.

And you

11

said that those were on February 18, 2010 and April 1,

12

2010; is that right?

13

A.

Yes.

14

Q.

And I think you said that you were at a meeting,

15

another COs' meeting prior to February 18, 2010 and at that

16

meeting DI Mauriello made some statements, right?

17

A.

Yes.

18

Q.

And those statements related to Schoolcraft; is

19

that right?

20

A.

Yes.

21

Q.

Can you tell me how many days, weeks, months or

22
23

.
::- ......
...

-;

·)

~

were made in relationship to the February 18, 2010 meeting

24
\

whatever other way you can measure it that those statements

that you recorded?

25

A.

It probably would have been right before this

DIAMOND REPORTING

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JOSEPH FERRARA
1

February 18th, so whatever CO meeting there was before that

2

it probably would have been at that meeting that I first

3

heard it or -- I don't know how -- you know, I don't recall

4

how often he had COs' meetings, but it probably would have

5

been the most recent one before that.

6

Q.

Okay.

So, sitting here today it's your belief

7

that that meeting which prompted you to make the recording

8

on February 18th happened two or four weeks, approximately,

9

before February 18, 2010?

10

A.

Yeah, probably.

11

Q.

Do you --

12
13

MR. LEE:
Q.

Objection to form.

Do you recall what Mauriello said at that

14

meeting, the one that preceded the February 18, 2010

15

meeting that you did record?

16

A.

Just that Schoolcraft's a rat, something to that

17

effect.

18

word exactly what was said.

19

Q.

Schoolcraft and a rat.

I don't remember word for

Did Mauriello say in your presence words to the

20

effect that he knew that Schoolcraft was a rat or that he

21

had been given information about that or ·anything like

22

that?

23

A.

I think he said something to the effect that I've

24
'-~
__ /)

got a heads up, but I really don't remember and that would

25

have been prior to those -- those two recordings.
DIAMOND REPORTING

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JOSEPH FERRARA
1

Q.

The statement that Mauriello made about him

I

2

getting a heads up, was that the same meeting where he

3

for that -- on that first occasion said that Schoolcraft is

4

a rat?

5

A.

You know, I don't remember.

6

Q.

Okay.

So, the

let me ask you this question,

7

you -- there was talk at the 81 after Schoolcraft was taken

8

to the Jamaica Hospital psych ward, right?

9

A.

Yes.

10

Q.

Do you recall or do you know whether or not the

11

statement that Mauriello made that he got a heads up about

12

Schoolcraft, did that happen before or after Schoolcraft

13

was taken to the Jamaica Hospital psych ward?
MR. KRETZ:

14
15

16

A.

Objection to form.

Probably after the incident with him being taken

to the hospital.

17

Q.

All right.

Why do you say probably after?

18

A.

I really don't remember and the talk was that

19

Schoolcraft had a tape-recorder the night of this incident

20

with him going to the hospital, so I'm assuming that it

21

probably was after the incident that urn, that he -- I mean,

22

I'm just assuming, you know, that he said it after that

23

because now they found a tape-recorder supposedly that

24

night and you know.

25

Q.

Okay.

DIAMOND REPORTING

So, it's fair to say that you're not
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JOSEPH FERRARA
really sure, it's hard for to you in pin down exactly when
this statement by Mauriello that he got a heads up about

3

)

1

2

\

Schoolcraft when that was; is that fair to say?

4

A.

Yeah, it's hard to pin down.

5

Q.

Okay.

When you said that there was talk at the

6

81 about finding a tape-recorder, was that the same kind of

7

talk that you mentioned earlier in your testimony, you were

8

at the -- at the desk or near the desk and people were just

9

talking back and forth about what happened to Schoolcraft?

10

A.

Yes.

11

Q.

So, was

is it fair to say that it was a

12

subject of discussion that Schoolcraft had a tape-recorder

13

on him the night that the commander officer at the 81 went

14

to his house?

15

A.

Oh, it was part of the discussion, I don't think

16

it was the subject.

17

hospital, you know, being taken to the hospital that night

18

was really the subject and I think this was just another

19

piece that, you know, came of it.

20
21
22

Q.

The bigger thing was him going to the

And when -- when Mauriello said that he got a

heads up, what is your understanding him to be saying?

A.

Well, my opinion was that somebody from either

23
24
.,_

,•

·.)

~

quad or Internal Affairs Bureau told Mauriello hey, listen,
we're looking at your command and you know, heads up, you

25

know, we're looking at your command.
DIAMOND REPORTING

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JOSEPH FERRARA
1
2
3

Q.

Would that be an appropriate thing for an

investigator of Quad or IAB to have done?

A.

Yeah, yeah, that shouldn't -- they are not

4

supposed to give COs a heads up to investigations, these

5

investigations are confidential.

6

7

Q.

So, it would be inappropriate for IAB or Quad to

give a heads up to the commanding officer, right?

8

A.

Yes, it would be inappropriate.

9

Q.

You mentioned that you were asked questions about

10

whether or not or why you would not trust an individual by

11

the name of del Pozo and I think what you said, I'm not

12

trying to characterize what you said, but I think what you

13

said was that he used to work for Campisi and on that basis

14

you said I wouldn't trust him.

Do you remember that?

15

A.

Yes.

16

Q.

Can you explain why it is that you felt that it

17

was not a good idea to trust somebody who had previously

18

worked for Chief Campisi?
MS. PUBLICKER METTHAM:

19

20

A.

Objection.

Captains and above stick together.

So, it's

21

if you're below captain it is what it is and if you're

22

captain and above they all stick together.

23

del Pozo worked for Campisi, he's captain and above, that

24

there's a more -- I guess more loyalty to Campisi than

25

really to anybody else outside of IAB because he directly
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So, I felt like

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worked for him.

2

I believe he was the commanding officer of one of

3

the groups in lAB, so there was a close working

4

relationship between del Pozo and Campisi himself as well

5

as the other chiefs in the bureau.

6

Q.

Had you ever heard of other occasions where COs

7

got a heads up about investigations that were going on

8

about their commands?

9
10

A.

Yeah, I heard -- I've heard people talk that a CO

was given a heads up.

11

Q.

Where

12

A.

I was in IAB because there was a group 56 CO who

where were you when you heard this?

13

was -- Captain -- his name slips my mind, but he was the

14

group 56 CO after Lunetta.

15

investigations on him, you know, allegations of corruption

16

and misconduct within his group that was against him and he

17

knew about every single one of them.

18

somebody find out about it if somebody higher up in IAB is

19

not telling him?

20

Q.

I think he had several

You know.

How does

I got a little bit jumbled up about your career,

21

I'm sure you covered it, I'm just not clear.

22

bear with me.

23
24

25

I hope you

For how years did you work at IAB?

A.

I believe all together it was five, I believe it

was probably close to three years as a sergeant and maybe

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two years as a lieutenant.

2

maybe.

3

4
5

Q.

Four plus years all together,

Do you recall any other circumstances where COs

got heads up other than the ones you've mentioned today?
A.

Just -- no, that -- that's really hit.

I mean

6

people talk, you know, from group to group people talk

7

about this CO, that CO.

8

definitely, you know, I know that the group 56 CO

9

definitely got a heads up because my wife worked in group

You know, I mean I can't say

10

56 until she retired and she was made aware that, you know,

11

there was allegations being made against that commanding

12

officer, so that I definitely knew because she knew.

13

As far as anybody else, I mean there was always

14

word of

15

IAB tipped off so and so and you know, because the job --

16

the job tries to protect who they like, you know.

17

are-- there are some COs who get hit for fudging numbers

18

and they get transferred.

19

fudging numbers and they get told you got to leave, you got

20

to retire.

21

you know, there was always word that oh, yeah,

There

There are some COs who hit for

Urn, the -- the CO in group 56 before Captain

22

Lunetta was this woman Captain Ferman, she was

23

African-American woman, she got caught fudging numbers

24

which was tied into the whole Brohenny thing that we spoke

25

about earlier with the computer misuse that he ran a nephew
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of a CO to see if he had a warrant, this was that captain.

2

So, she had this lieutenant run her nephew's name, but she

3

got caught up with fudging numbers.

4

she got to go, she got to retire.

5

we're going to move you somewhere else, you got -- you got

6

your 20 years in, you got to go.

7

Okay.

She was told

You know, there was no

Urn, on patrol, certain COs -- there was a CO in

8

the 105 at some point who -- who ended up getting jammed up

9

for fudging numbers, he got moved.

You know.

So, it's

10

they protect who they want to protect.

11

know when they want to let people know to protect those

12

people, hey, listen, just so you know.

13
14

Q.

They let people

Did you have any direct interaction with

Schoolcraft while you were at the 81 and he was at the 81?

15

A.

Just hello.

16

Q.

Did he ever do or say anything to you that --

17

that indicated to you that he was anything but just a

18

regular police officer?

19

A.

No.

20

MS. PUBLICKER METTHAM:

Objection.

21

A.

No.

22

Q.

I think you were asked this, but I'm not sure.

23
24
25

Do you

well, let me just back up.
The incident where the CO went to Schoolcraft's

house that occurred on October 31, 2009.
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And I think you

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she would use her cell phone while she was working on the

2

desk?

3

A.

Well, I would say -MS. PUBLICKER METTHAM:

4

5

A.

Objection.

I would say she used her cell phone more than

6

other people who would be assigned to the desk.

7

don't have a lot of time to talk on the cell phone when

8

you're on the desk, there are so many things going on in

9

the precinct at that desk area and -- but I know she -- you

10
11

You really

know, some people like to talk, you know, that was my -Q.

Was she one of them?
MS. PUBLICKER METTHAM:

12

Objection.

13

A.

Yeah, that was my perception of her, was that she

14

she liked to talked on her cell phone, you know.

I

15

didn't see her, urn, I didn't see her interact with people

16

in the -- in -- in the 81 as often as I've seen in the past

17

with other people.

18

she spoke to whoever she spoke to on the phone, that was

19

her form of communicating with other people.

20
21
22

Q.

You know, it kind of looked to me like

Do you have any recollection of her interacting

or speaking with anybody at the 81 about Schoolcraft?
A.

No.
MS. PUBLICKER METTHAM:

23

Objection.

24

A.

No, I don't.

25

Q.

You mentioned in your earlier testimony about how

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the job sometimes punishes people.

2

you ever heard of an expression called the blue wall of

3

silence?

4

A.

Yes, I heard of that.

5

Q.

What is that?

6

A.

Well, my interpretation of the blue wall of

In that context, have

7

silence is cops don't talk about what other cops do.

8

something is done wrong, cops don't talk about it.

9
10

What happens to a cop in your perception who does

Q.

talk about what other cops do?

11
12

If

MS. PUBLICKER METTHAM:
A.

Well, they get labeled a rat.

Objection.
They get labeled a

13

rat and then their lives are made difficult by the other

14

members that they work with, whether it becomes people

15

don't want to work with that person anymore or cops are

16

known to flick -- flip other officers' lockers, so

17

everything that you have in your locker gets dumped upside

18

down.

19

the cop who said something and the cops didn't say

20

something.

21

Q.

You know.

You know, just general tension between

In the, I think you still have it in front of

22
23

Commissioner Kelly.

24

~~

you, Exhibit A, there's a memo or a 49 from you to Police

12153.

25

A.

It's got a Bates stamp number of

Could you put that document in front of you, sir?
Yes.

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