Schoolcraft v. The City Of New York et al

Filing 625

DECLARATION of Reply Declaration of Joshua Fitch in Support re: 559 MOTION for Attorney Fees , Costs and Disbursements.. Document filed by Adrian Schoolcraft. (Attachments: # 1 Exhibit Ex. A - note from Kin mar Lwin, # 2 Exhibit Ex. B - Portions of Patel Deposition, # 3 Exhibit Ex. C - Portions of Bernier Deposition, # 4 Exhibit Ex. D - note from Khuso Tariq, # 5 Exhibit Ex. E - Portions of Lwin Deposition, # 6 Exhibit Ex. F - Report of Frank Dowling, # 7 Exhibit Ex. G - Report of Tancredi, # 8 Exhibit Ex. H - Report of Levy, # 9 Exhibit Ex. I - Report of Lubit, # 10 Exhibit Ex. J - Portion of Sawyer Deposition, # 11 Exhibit Ex. K - Section of Hospital Chart, # 12 Exhibit Ex L - Section of Hospital Chart, # 13 Exhibit Ex. M - Sgt. Chu Summary, # 14 Exhibit Ex. N - Sgt. Chu Interview, # 15 Exhibit Ex. O - Portion of Isakov JPTO, # 16 Exhibit Ex. P - Portions of Lamstein Deposition, # 17 Exhibit Ex. Q - Various Emails to and from defense counsel (redacted), # 18 Exhibit Ex. R - Various Emails (redacted), # 19 Exhibit Ex. S - Paid invoices)(Fitch, Joshua)

TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
IN RE: ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT V. NYPD, ET AL
JAMAICA HOSPITAL
FILE NO. CD TRACK 1

DATE: NOVEMBER 4, 2009

Transcript produced by:

American Legal Transcription
11 Market Street - Suite 215 - Poughkeepsie, NY 12601
Tel. [phone] - Fax: [phone]

[e-mail]

2
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

SERGEANT CHU:

That’s fine.

Today is

3

Wednesday, November 4th, 2009.

4

approximately 1410 hours.

5

Chu, Internal Affairs Bureau Group 1.

6

here at Jamaica Hospital in the Day Room of the

7

third floor Psych 3 Ward.

My name is Sergeant Wayne
I’m present

Present here is --

8

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

9

SERGEANT CHU:

Larry School --

I’m sorry.

10

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

11

SERGEANT CHU:

12

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

13

The time is

Okay.

Go, sir.

Adrian Schoolcraft.
And, sir?
Larry Schoolcraft.

Adrian, the patient's father.

14

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

Okay, good.

And

15

we're here with the medical staff from the Jamaica

16

Hospital Center.

17

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Detective, would they

18

willing to identify themselves, (indiscernible) and

19

their positions?

20

SERGEANT CHU:

21

for voice identification purposes?

22

DR. ISAKOV:

23

SERGEANT CHU:

24

MS. McMAHON:

25

worker.

Sir, just for the record,

I am Dr. Isakov.
Okay.

And, ma’am?

I'm Christine, social

3
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

SERGEANT CHU:

2

LARRY

3

Okay.

your last name?

SCHOOLCRAFT:

4

MS. McMAHON:

5

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

6

Christine, what’s

McMahon.
Doctor, what's your

first name?

7

DR. ISAKOV:

Isak.

8

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

9

DR. ISAKOV:

Isak.

10

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

11

DR. ISAKOV:

12

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

13

Okay.

14

First name?

I’m sorry?

Isak.
Okay.

Thank you.

can start it off.

15

I was called to the meeting by you, so you

DR. ISAKOV:

But, again, I -- I don’t know

16

what you want to talk to me with -- why I'm talking --

17

can talk to you about your son, what we gonna do, and

18

what else do you want to know?

19

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

I -- right now,

20

doctor, I know nothing, so, feel free to tell me

21

everything?

22

DR. ISAKOV:

Okay.

The same thing that I

23

don’t know too much, also, only what --

24

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

25

that’s not gonna --

Well, see that --

4
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

DR. ISAKOV:

told when he came to the emergency room --

3
4

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Right, doctor, I’m not

interested what (indiscernible) --

5
6

-- only -- only what your son

DR. ISAKOV: -- and when I spoke with him
today.

7

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I told no one

8

anything.

9

to the supervisors of the department.

10

They only talked
They only got

their story.

11
12

They didn’t talk to me.

DR. ISAKOV:

I know, but they interview

you too.

13

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

That doctor, she

14

never in -- she never asked me anything about what

15

happened.

16
17

DR. ISAKOV:

And -- but I met with and I

asked you today what happened.

18

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

19

time we ever met, right here.

20

DR. ISAKOV:

Right.

21

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

22

question.

23

his biological father.

24

detective, for the NYPD, okay?

25

This is the first

First time, yes.
Doctor, I have a

I didn’t mean to interrupt my son.

SERGEANT CHU:

I'm

I’m his emergency contact,

Yes.

5
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

They know this.

2

There’s policies and procedures in the NYPD.

3

broke down my son’s door and drug him out and put

4

him in a psychiatric unit and nobody, nobody, nobody

5

from the NYPD or the City of New York has contacted

6

me to tell me what’s going on with him.

7

SERGEANT CHU:

8

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

They

Nobody.

Okay.
Nobody.

I have called

9

the chief of Brooklyn North, Nelson, Marino, his

10

commander in the 81, Morello -- Mauriello, Steve

11

Mauriello, nobody has returned my calls and I have

12

called them 20 times in the last four days.

13

Nobody will return my calls and nobody will give me

14

information.

15

sure Adrian has told you who I am.

16

yesterday, when Christine called me at 3:00, when he

17

had been incarcerated, locked up --

Nobody from the hospital.

18

DR. ISAKOV:

19

LARRY

Nobody.

And I’m

Nobody, until

(Indiscernible) --

SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- had his freedom

20

taken away, wasn’t allowed to vote.

His freedom.

21

His very freedom.

22

from, Doc, but this is the United States of America.

23

I’m ex-military, he’s honorable military, and I’m

24

sure Detective Chu is ex-military.

25

SERGEANT CHU:

I don’t know what country you’re

Correct?

Well, actually, I’m not.

6
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

And just for the clarification, it’s Sergeant Chu.

2

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

3

SERGEANT CHU:

4

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

5

SERGEANT CHU:

6

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Sergeant.

Yeah.
So Detective Sergeant?

Yes.
Okay.

So you don’t

7

want to be called detective, you're called a

8

sergeant?

9

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah, that’s fine.

10

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

11

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

Just so, you know, I just

12

want -- you know, it’s not an issue, I just want you

13

to be --

14

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

15

SERGEANT CHU:

16
17
18
19
20
21

No.

-- clarified as to who I

am.
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Right.

Right.

I

appreciate it.
SERGEANT CHU:
he Detective Chu?

So, in case you do ask, was

They won’t know...

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

22

To get back on the doctor.

23

No.

Thanks.

Okay.

the hospital contacted me?

24
25

Why hasn’t anybody from

If you certainly want to help your patient
on getting him out here, wouldn’t his most primary

7
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

support system, that being his father, wouldn’t he

2

be the first one you would call before you even

3

admitted him?

4

to call?

5

cord, I’ve known him every day of his life, you

6

don’t think that was important?

Isn’t that the person you would want

The very person that cut his umbilical

7

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

8

DR. ISAKOV:

9

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Yeah, not -- not --

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- as I reported

10
11

DR. ISAKOV:

I understand --

criminal activity to?

12

Not the boss that --

-- I understand you

13

perfectly, but I'm working in in-patient, I don’t

14

know what happened when he was in emergency room.

15

Did anybody call?

16
17

I don’t know.

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
there.

Let’s not go back

Let’s know just what you know.

18

DR. ISAKOV:

19

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

After --

As soon --- he became [sic]

20

here, why didn’t you notify me?

21

DR. ISAKOV:

22

MS. McMAHON:

23

DR. ISAKOV:

24
25

As soon he come here -But we did.
-- is the first hour in

(inaudible) -MS. McMAHON:

I did call you.

I did

8
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

notify you.

2

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

3

MS. McMAHON:

4

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

5

MS. McMAHON:

6

When did you call me?

After I spoke with your son.
Okay.

He called you first and then

I called you.

7

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

8

DR. ISAKOV:

9

MS. McMAHON:

10

Yesterday.
Yesterday afternoon.

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

So you

Right.

Three days?

Three days?

13
14

-- and when was that?

were notified that he was here.

11
12

And --

DR. ISAKOV:

No.

It was the first time

here yesterday.

15

MS. McMAHON:

Right.

We can’t speak to

16

what happened in the emergency room.

17

in the emergency room.

18

LARRY

19

SCHOOLCRAFT:

We don’t work

for three days?

20

DR. ISAKOV:

21

MS. McMAHON:

22

DR. ISAKOV:

23
24
25

So where has he been

He come to the unit -We cannot speak to that.
He come to the unit yesterday

and -LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
been for three days?

Okay.

Where has he

9
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

DR. ISAKOV:
right away.

3
4

-- you got the phone call

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

DR. ISAKOV:

6

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

7

MS. McMAHON:

MS. McMAHON:
that.

12

Probably, yes, you should have been notified.

DR. ISAKOV:
father?

17

DR. ISAKOV:

Yes, multiple times.

Did you give the phone number

downstairs?

19

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

20

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

21

DR. ISAKOV:

Yes.
Yes.

Did they tell you that they

tried (indiscernible)?

23

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

24

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

25

I appreciate --

Did you request to call your

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

22

Okay.

I appreciate that, Christine.

16

18

And --

I mean, I do understand

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

14
15

Okay.

And we understand your

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

10

13

In emergency room.

frustration that nobody called you.

9

11

Where has he

been for three days?

5

8

Okay.

I don’t remember.
Nobody's contacted me.

I have a cell phone like everybody.

I have a home

10
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

phone, I have voice mail.

2

DR. ISAKOV:

3

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

4

DR. ISAKOV:

5

Again, I --

-- I don’t know what happened

in the emergency room.

6

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

7

DR. ISAKOV:

8

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

9

DR. ISAKOV:

10

It’s all documented.

I understand.

If you have a -I'm not --

-- complaint, you can go

and (inaudible) --

11

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

I understand.

12

Doctor, I’m not expecting you to elaborate on issues

13

that you are not aware of, just what you know of,

14

that’s all.

15
16

DR. ISAKOV:

(Indiscernible).

As soon he

came, the phone call was made.

17

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

18

Now, Ms. McMahon, yesterday, I have a -- I

19

had a question for you and you didn’t answer it, and

20

I think we need to answer it now.

21

MS. McMAHON:

22
23

Right.

I don’t think it’s

important.
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Well, first of all,

24

before we go that route; would you tell me what your

25

position is here?

What’s your duties?

11
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

MS. McMAHON:
social worker.

3
4

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

MS. McMAHON:

Primarily, discharge

planning.

7

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

8

MS. McMAHON:

9

What -- tell me what

those duties are?

5
6

I just told you, I’m a

Okay.

And --

I work with the team here,

primarily discharge (inaudible) --

10

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- would you

11

describe your daily duties, on what you do, and

12

what’s your -- what your duties are?

13

responsibilities are?

14
15

MS. McMAHON:

18
19
20
21

Assessment, discharge

planning, work with the team --

16
17

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

MS. McMAHON:

-- you know, to facilitate

discharge for the patient.
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Right.

Okay.

And do

you have to be certified for that?
MS. McMAHON:

23

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

25

Work with the team.

Okay.

22

24

What your

Of course.
Okay.

What’s the

certification called?
MS. McMAHON:

It’s state licensure in

12
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

social work.

2

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

3

MS. McMAHON:

4

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

5

MS. McMAHON:

Okay.

Is it the

Department of Health, Department of Education?
MS. McMAHON:

State.

State Department of

Education.

12
13

It’s a license to practice

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

10
11

Is it a particular

social work.

8
9

Yeah.

specific type of license?

6
7

Social work.

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Department of

Education.

14

MS. McMAHON:

15

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay.

Now, what information do you have

16

Yes.
Yes, I’m aware it’s

the state.

17
18

on Adrian?

And I’d like to see all the information

19

that you have on Adrian.

20

MS. McMAHON:

21

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

22

MS. McMAHON:

23
24
25

I -I want --

-- I told

you the

information that I have.
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
I want the files.

No, I want to see it.

I want them opened.

I want

13
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

copies.

I am his power of attorney, I am his

2

healthcare proxy.

I want everything.

3

I wanna read it.

I wanna document it.

4

it out of here with me.

5
6

DR. ISAKOV:

Everything.
I wanna take

You need to make an official

request and the copy will be given to you.

7

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay.

Forget the

8

copies now, bring the paperwork in here so I can

9

read them.

10

Now, how can I help you, help him, if I

11

don’t have the information that you have, doctor?

12
13

DR. ISAKOV:
(inaudible) --

14
15

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

No.

The information

you --

16
17

The information is right here

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

What are you writing

LARRY

The information

down?

18

SCHOOLCRAFT:

19

you're evaluating as, is something you've got

20

written down.

21

paperwork that has anything to do with him, bring it

22

in here --

23
24
25

I wanna see it.

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
administrator up here.

Go get all your

Perhaps you need an

There's --

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

No.

I asked for --

14
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- actual accomplices

to this abduction.

3

LARRY

4

-- do you know Dr. Vivek?

5

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Do you -- do you know

I’m sure you do, right?

Why don’t you call the chairman and see if

6

he’ll come down here and then we can talk, okay,

7

Doc?

Go do that.

8
9
10

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
being disrespectful.

DR. ISAKOV:

You’ve

I -- I -taken

a man’s

freedom.
ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Can I go, Doc?

Doctor, can I go?

17
18

I still -- I still don’t

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

15
16

This is, I’ve been held

understand where you leading it to?

13
14

And, Doc, we are not

captive here for --

11
12

We’ll take a rest.

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Adrian, come on.

Adrian, forget it.

19

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Can I go?

20

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

We can go.

21

Get up.

22
23

We can go.

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
me.

Then you don’t need

Everything's fine, right?

24

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

We can go.

25

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Let’s go.

15
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Open the door, let's

go, we’re going out.

3

Come on, Detective, it’s over.

4

SERGEANT CHU:

5

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

6

Sir, it’s -Come on, Adrian.

Come

on.

7

SERGEANT CHU:

While we’re here, it was

8

brought to my attention that you stated that one of

9

the uniform members of the service, what was

10

communicated to me, stomped on your face?

11

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Chief Marino needs to

12

be charged with attempted murder.

13

SERGEANT CHU:

14

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

15

Okay.
After the EMS stated

that my vital signs were --

16

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

17

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Tachy.
-- such -- yeah, he

18

used the word “tachy” -- in such a way that I had to

19

go to the hospital, he then gave the order to attack

20

me.

21

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

22

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

They assaulted me.

23

had asked for pictures by the hospital, IAB hasn’t

24

come and take photographs.

25

SERGEANT CHU:

I have a camera here.

Do

I

16
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

you authorize --

2

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

3

SERGEANT CHU:

4

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

5

-- me taking photographs?

SERGEANT CHU:

7

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
anything.

9

Well, you know --

Okay.

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

SERGEANT CHU:

13

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay.

DR. ISAKOV:

16

SERGEANT CHU:

17

DR. ISAKOV:

18

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

19

DR. ISAKOV:

20

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

22

He stomped on my

face, he gave the order, I was assaulted.

15

21

-- needs to be

charged with attempted murder.

12

14

But I’ll take

But Chief Marino of Brooklyn North -SERGEANT CHU:

10
11

-- what is it, four

days later?

6

8

Yeah, three --

Can you come with me -Okay.
-- to administration?
Yep.

Can Adrian go?

No.
Well, then bring him

here.
DR. ISAKOV:

23

LARRY

25

administration?

You can come with me to

administration.

24

No.

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Where is

17
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

SERGEANT CHU:

Sir, during this time, I

will get the statement from --

3

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay (inaudible) --

4

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I don’t think you

5

should go anywhere alone.

6

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Detective, why don’t

7

you go with me to administration, then we'll come

8

back together?

9
10

SERGEANT CHU:

You know what, I -- I

have --

11

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

12

SERGEANT CHU:

13

Sir, I have full faith in

that the hospital staff will treat you respectful.

14

LARRY

15

SERGEANT CHU:

16

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

17

SCHOOLCRAFT:

You do?

Yes.
Even though they've

incarcerated him for four days?

18
19

(Indiscernible).

SERGEANT CHU:

Well, you know, we have

(inaudible) --

20

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Can I at least get a

21

reason why I've been incarcerated?

22

want.

23
24
25

DR. ISAKOV:

It's not incarceration, it’s

a hospital, sir.
SERGEANT CHU:

That’s all I

So --

18
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

2

jails a hospital these days.

3

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

4

SERGEANT CHU:

Well, they call the

A big gulag.

If I can get that

5

information for you, I will, but, at this time, I

6

just want to address the specific physical

7

contact.

8
9
10

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

See if you can make a

copy of those while you’re up there, the eight
pages --

11

SERGEANT CHU:

12

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

13

So --- and then just give

it to (inaudible) --

14

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

15

SERGEANT CHU:

Oh, okay.

But if you would escort --

16

you know, follow -- I -- I do have faith in, you

17

know --

18

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay.

Then if you

19

tell them, all right, if they’re bringing me back

20

here, ask them?

21
22
23
24
25

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

Sir, is -- is Mr.

Schoolcraft coming back to this facility?
DR. ISAKOV:

Yes.

It depend on what

administration (inaudible) -SERGEANT CHU:

Well --

19
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

That kind of sounded a

little vague.

3

SERGEANT CHU:

Well, like yourself, like

4

myself, here, we are actually here at the -- we are

5

under the directive of the hospital staff.

6
7

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
criminal investigation --

8

SERGEANT CHU:

9

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

10

They can hinder a

No, but --- attempted murder

charge?

11

SERGEANT CHU:

No.

But I’m getting your

12

statement and that’s my main focus right now is to

13

get your statement as it pertains to the physical

14

contact.

15
16

On that same note, though -ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I made -- I made

the complaint that I was abducted --

17

SERGEANT CHU:

18

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

19

No.

Yeah.
-- and I’m being held

here --

20

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

21

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

22

SERGEANT CHU:

-- against my will.

But I just want to address

23

the -- at first, right now --

24

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

25

SERGEANT CHU:

I understand that.

-- the physical contact

20
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

that was made by Chief Marino.

2
3

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

SERGEANT CHU:

5

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

And I --

SERGEANT CHU:

8

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

10
11
12
13
14
15
16

-- so, I don’t

understand, Sergeant Scott was here, right?

7

9

I

mean --

4

6

I understand.

Yes.
Hasn’t this story all

been told?
SERGEANT CHU:

Have you -- you told him

the entire story -- the story in its entirety?
ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I think, yeah.

Well,

I mean, up to now, no, I was in the psych ER.
SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

I mean, there was a

statement given to Sergeant Scott already?
ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

But, yeah, the -- the

17

event of breaking in and dragging me out and

18

assaulting me and --

19
20
21
22

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

statement's already been -ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Well, I’ll give it

again, whatever you need.

23

SERGEANT CHU:

24

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

25

So your -- your

No, but as it pertains -And I have it written

out up to the point where I got to the ER.

21
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

SERGEANT CHU:

2

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

3
4

Okay.
He’ll make copies of

it (inaudible).
SERGEANT CHU:

Oh, no, but if your

5

statement's already been given to Sergeant Scott or

6

by -- to another I -- Group 1 investigator, then I

7

won’t, you know, rehash it with you then, if it’s

8

specific statements as to what the specific members

9

of the service did to you, so...

10
11
12
13
14
15

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Well, take the copies

with you -LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

I got them

(inaudible) -ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Don't give them the

originals, give them the copies.

16

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

17

SERGEANT CHU:

I will.

But you articulated what

18

Chief Marino specifically did, what other uniform

19

members of the service specifically did?

20

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Chief Marino and an

21

unidentified bald black male with the inspections

22

lieutenant, I think he said his name was Gough --

23

SERGEANT CHU:

24

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

25

Um-hmm.
-- those are the only

ones that I could identify as grabbing me.

There

22
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

were more, but as soon as I looked up to see who it

2

was, that’s when Chief Marino stomped me, stomped on

3

my head, to cover my eyes with his boot and then

4

rubbed my face into the carpet.

5

said, "He is tachy, he needs to go to the hospital.

6

I can’t -- I can’t let you refuse," what he told me.

7

SERGEANT CHU:

8

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

9

This was after EMS

Yeah.
And, after they

handcuffed me -- well, they -- first they held me in

10

this torture position for, I don’t know, it felt

11

like forever.

12

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

13

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

But it wasn’t -- I

14

wasn’t resisting at all.

I was laying in my bed, I

15

said I don’t feel good.

16

handcuffs and they just -- I could feel both their

17

hands around each wrist, doing this.

Then they finally put the

18

SERGEANT CHU:

19

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

20
21
22
23

Okay.
And I could feel my

wrists cracking.
SERGEANT CHU:

So you identified

Lieutenant Gough and a male black bald man?
ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

24

counterpart, it seemed.

25

SERGEANT CHU:

Who was his

I think they were together.
Okay.

And they are from,

23
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

you indicated, which unit?

2

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

3

SERGEANT CHU:

4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11

They are from where, again?

I’m sorry.
ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

The Borough

Investigations Unit.
ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

I have no idea.
Marino, was he in

uniform or -ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

13

SERGEANT CHU:

15

I think that he -- he

said he was inspections.

12

14

What’s that?

He was in uniform.

Was there any other uniform

members that you observed?
ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Lieutenant -- I don’t

16

know if it's 81, Lieutenant Broschart (phonetical)

17

or Bratwurst (phonetical), or something like that.

18

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

Did you observe any

19

specific interaction he had with you, as far as any

20

direct physical contact?

21

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

22

got to ER, he wouldn’t loosen the cuffs.

23

SERGEANT CHU:

24

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

25

Other than, when we

Okay.
They -- they released

this one, but I was -- they wouldn’t loosen this

24
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

one.

I was treated like an Hannibal Lecter and I

2

did nothing to cause that.

3

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

4

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

When they rolled me

5

over, Chief Marino sat on my bed.

He goes, "Officer

6

Schoolcraft, we’re just trying to help you," in a --

7

in a smirky tone.

The bald black guy --

8

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

9

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

10

pockets.

11

it to Chief Marino.

12

He’s got recording devices."

13

-- searched my

shelf next to my bed.

14

He found a recorder in my pocket.

He gave

He goes, "Oh, he’s being cute.
He lays it on the

They go through my pockets, they find my

15

keys.

He gives my keys to -- I didn’t see who he

16

gave it to, exactly, but I’m assuming it was the

17

lieutenant.

18

SERGEANT CHU:

19

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

20

that’s the last I saw or heard the keys.

21

hear them drop on a shelf or anything, I didn’t hear

22

them go into a pocket or anything.

23

Yeah.

He found my wallet.

And the lieutenant -I didn’t

Chief Marino goes,

24

count -- count what’s in his wallet, blah, blah,

25

blah.

Do you want it back?

Yeah, I want a back.

25
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

Give -- they put it back in my pocket.

2

he did this.

3

on my knees, facing him, sitting on my bed.

4

-- while they were lifting me up, he, with his left

5

hand, took the recorder back off the shelf, put it

6

in his right hand, put it in his suit jacket pocket.

7

It was a black Olympus WS331M digital recorder.

And then they picked me up, forced me

8

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

9

SERGEANT CHU:

10
11

Then -- then

While I

Sorry.

331M?

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I think that’s the

model number.

12

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

13

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

It’s a little black

14

digital recorder, you break it apart and it has a

15

USB on the other end.

16
17

SERGEANT CHU:

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

SERGEANT CHU:

Olympus,

-- you don’t have to --

it’s almost like a iPod shape.

22
23

Right.

black.

20
21

It has

like a USB port built in, so --

18
19

I -- I've seen it.

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

A little bit like...
Yep.

Something like

that.

24

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

25

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay.
And he said -- he

26
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

made some statement, I can’t remember what it was,

2

because they had me kneeling before him, while he’s

3

sitting on my bed, in my home.

4

carried me off.

5

SERGEANT CHU:

And then they

Okay.

Did you ever have

6

any previous interaction with Chief Marino, direct

7

or indirect, or was this the first time?

8

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

9
10

I don’t -- he was the CO of the 75, when I was
there.

11
12

I've seen him before,

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

But this would be

your first type of --

13

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

14

SERGEANT CHU:

15

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Yeah.

-- any type of interaction?
No.

16

said, "I don’t know who you are."

17

who I am."

18

He stated, he

officer, or something like that.

And he said, I don’t know who you are,

19

SERGEANT CHU:

20

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

21

Okay.
And, I don’t know, I

have eight pages written down --

22

SERGEANT CHU:

23

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

24

SERGEANT CHU:

25

I go, "You know

Okay.

No, that’s fine.
-- (inaudible).

One of the things that was

relayed to me, because there was, you know,

27
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

statements made by you of -- of physical contact by

2

the officers and injuries (inaudible), come and take

3

photographs, if I may be permitted.

4

have any issues with me taking a photo --

5

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

6

SERGEANT CHU:

7

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

8

Okay.

Do you

I've been asking --

-- photographs?
-- for that since day

one.

9

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

10

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Begging for it.
Sergeant James and

11

Lieutenant Bratwurst also denied my request to

12

contact IAB.

13

date down on paper -- I think it was yesterday.

14

IAB didn’t come until -- I wrote the

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

And you just have to

15

-- you have to -- like you have to know that I don’t

16

know your --

17
18

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
are, I'm just --

19
20

SERGEANT CHU:

-- so Sergeant James is?

Sergeant James is who?

21
22

I don't know who they

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

81st Precinct

sergeant.

23

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

24

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

25

SERGEANT CHU:

She's a black female.

Is she assigned to any

28
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

particular thing in the bureau that you know of, a

2

squad, assignment?

3

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

4

SERGEANT CHU: Okay.

5

I have no idea.
You just know her as

she’s Sergeant James from the 81?

6

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

7

had no idea who she is.

8

SERGEANT CHU:

She just got there, I

9

And who was the other

person?

10

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Well, the one that

11

came in the ambulance with me was Lieutenant --

12

again, he’s new -- Lieutenant Bratwurst or

13

Broschart, or something like that.

14

request to see IAB.

15

SERGEANT CHU:

16

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

17

All denied my

Okay.
And to loosen the

cuffs.

18

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

19

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

When I -- when the

20

nurse told me someone was trying to call for me, and

21

I requested they answer the phone, they just sat

22

there.

23

gurney, I pulled the gurney with me to the phone,

24

that’s when Lieut -- Sergeant James told me to get

25

off the phone, she pushed the gurney into a girl in

They didn’t do anything.

I got out of the

29
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

a wheel chair.

2

didn’t do anything because, you know, I wanna answer

3

the phone.

4

I’m sure I was blamed for that.

I

So, she pulled the phone, she broke the

5

wire out of the phone.

Whoever was on the phone,

6

whatever, I had no phone call.

7

gurney.

8

if they called back, she'll find out who it is and

9

she was looking out for me.

So I got back in the

Lynn, the nurse, said she would, you know,

10

After that, Sergeant James got on Officer

11

Soworski’s (phonetical) -- I’m not sure what his

12

name is.

13

shift --

There’s a couple “skis” on the midnight

14

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

15

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- this was Soworski

16

(phonetical), Saworsko (phonetical), whoever she was

17

with, she was using his cell phone.

18

on the phone and tell the desk, I think it was

19

Sergeant Manhorn (phonetical), that Schoolcraft is

20

wallowing out, blah, blah, blah.

21

something.

22

Sergeant James and the officer, and said, you know,

23

when this person calls, what do I tell them?

24

just give them -- just give them the number to the

25

81st Precinct.

I heard her get

Well, I skipped

Just before that, staff went to them,

Well,

And I said, I’m not going anywhere

30
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

with you.

And she gets on the phone and that’s when

2

I -- I became a --

3

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

4

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

5

SERGEANT CHU:

6

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

A ward of the state.
Correct.

Okay.
She went -- she

7

walked -- which I didn’t know at the time, what it

8

was -- she walked to where -- she walked outside the

9

ER, on the cell phone, on that officer’s cell phone,

10

when she came back out about 20 minutes later, she

11

walked to the Psych ER, and that’s where there’s

12

supposedly some statement that is unsigned stating

13

that I ran from them and -- what's the word they

14

used -- barricaded myself in my house.

15
16

SERGEANT CHU:

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

21
22
23
24
25

Nobody's advised me

anything.

19
20

When did you -- when

were you advised that you were now a patient here?

17
18

Okay.

SERGEANT CHU:

All right.

But when

were -ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I haven’t been treated

for anything.
SERGEANT CHU:

When were you -- at some

point, you were (inaudible) -ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

All they said is, I

31
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

can’t -- I overheard, was it Monday, Monday morning

2

I was supposed to be seen.

3

out in the hallway, next to the nurses’ station.

4

heard an Indian voice -- I heard a loud female voice

5

say, What about Schoolcraft?

6

something like this, He’s going today, right?

7

another quieter Indian voice stated, No, he’s

8

special, he’s not going anywhere.

9

SERGEANT CHU:

10
11

They had me in a bed,

What is School...

I

Or
And

And --

Okay.

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- I believe that

(inaudible).

12

SERGEANT CHU:

13

some photographs.

14

All right.

Let me take

taken.

15

I do see some marks that will be

As you know, what I'll do first is take a

16

-- you know, keep your gown on, first, so I can take

17

a whole body shot identifying that this is the

18

person that I’m taking, you know, as I take

19

additional close ups.

20

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Do you have a cameras,

21

sergeant, that do bruises better today than years

22

ago?

23
24
25

Or it's still hard to do bruises, isn't it?
SERGEANT CHU:

No, I mean this -- this is

a pretty decent camera, we have.
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Is it -- is it a

32
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

special something?
SERGEANT CHU:

Well, I mean it’s -- I

3

assure you this is a camera that most precincts

4

won’t even ever have, like a --

5

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

6

SERGEANT CHU:

7
8
9
10
11

Right.

-- so, you know, it's a

small (inaudible) -LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

It’s a good camera.

I know, 'cause years ago it was tough, you know,
bruises is tough to get.
SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

And actually -- and

12

also -- as you know, also, that, you know, if you’re

13

concerned about a photograph not being taken right

14

away, you know, bruises tend to -- to develop --

15

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

16

SERGEANT CHU:

Right.

-- it's takes them a

17

certain amount of time period, anyway, so, let me

18

take some shots here.

19
20

Okay, great.

Just step to that blue zone

over there, where, this way I can get a (inaudible).

21

Let's take the closest profile.

22

Now, you had -- you did have some stuff on

23
24
25

your face, that the foot was placed (inaudible) -ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
pretty much gone down.

It was red, but it’s

33
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay. But, you know what,

2

I’m just going to document -- I'm just going to

3

indicate that.

4

So it was the right facial region?

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

He had -- his foot

5

was on my left -- left side of my face and the right

6

side of my face was being rubbed into the ground.

7

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

So, it's actually

8

both, both sides of your face that had some physical

9

contact; one with the ground and the other one with

10

the...

11

And just to clarify, when you say,

12

"ground," you meant the ground?

13

(inaudible) --

14
15

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

SERGEANT CHU:

And what kind of flooring

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

23

SERGEANT CHU:

25

(Inaudible).

Now,

let me see (inaudible)...

22

24

Like a commercial

carpet.

20
21

The floor

surface is (inaudible) --

18
19

My floor.

of my bedroom.

16
17

Or was it

there.

(Inaudible).

(Inaudible).

Let me see your wrists

All right.

(Inaudible).

At this point, what has -- what has been

34
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

explained to you, as far as your -- what will be --

2

what the hospital feels that they -- they deem that

3

it's necessary?

4

by the hospital staff?

5

What has been communicated to you

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

They haven’t

6

communicated anything to me, other than that I’m

7

paranoid, because I live at home alone without my

8

parents or a wife.

9

afraid armed officers, that I reported crimes of,

10

I’m -- I’m paranoid because I’m

will -- will hurt me.

11

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

All right.

Was this

12

date, sir, was this the first time you were -- it

13

was brought to your attention to come today, also,

14

as well?

15

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

16

SERGEANT CHU:

Correct.

Okay.

Yes, sir.

All right.

You

17

know, I -- I -- I just want to, like your -- like

18

myself, you know, I am sort of under a certain

19

obligation to follow their directives here.

20

I cannot make a determination whether you should be

21

discharged at this time.

22

recommendations to them about --

I cannot make any

23

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

24

SERGEANT CHU:

25

know --

I mean,

No, I understand that.

-- any particular, you

35
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

I’m just -- all I’m

2

concerned is -- is documenting, doing the

3

investigation, and if him being contained in here is

4

gonna thwart that, and I believe that’s what these

5

certain corrupt members of the NYPD, they did it for

6

this reason.

7

SERGEANT CHU:

8

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

9

circulation.

Yeah.
The took him out of

It not only discredits him by being

10

put in a psych ward, but it also keeps him out of

11

circulation, incommunicado.

12

SERGEANT CHU:

(Inaudible).

13

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

He hasn’t been able to

14

see an attorney, he hasn’t been able to do anything,

15

he wasn’t able to vote yesterday.

16

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Do I -- do I report

17

the unlawful entering and searching, search and

18

seizure of property from my home --

19

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

20

Aggravated kidnapping.

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- by Captain

21

Lauterborn, Deputy Inspector Mauriello and the other

22

-- the other ones I don’t know?

23

SERGEANT CHU:

Anything you are

24

specifically alleging, as it pertains to other

25

members of the service, you -- those allegations can

36
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

be addressed through us, Internal Affairs Bureau

2

Group 1, because, you know, you are making

3

allegations, whether they're criminal or just, you

4

know, general departmental administrative, but

5

anything that -- any -- any criminal allegations

6

that you're making, any corruption allegations that

7

you are making, would be done formally through

8

Internal Affairs.

9

want to make sure that Sergeant Scott’s been aware,

I know you, just to -- I just

10

made aware, of all of these specific -- just for the

11

record --

12
13

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I don’t know if he

recorded it.

14

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

But just for the

15

record, so that you know that I am receiving your

16

complaint as it pertains to members of the service.

17
18

I know you have some concerns about the
hospital here, that is --

19

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

20

SERGEANT CHU:

21

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

22

SERGEANT CHU:

23
24
25

Yes.

-- not under my purview.

Okay.

Right.
I understand your

concern, but it’s not something I can address.
Okay.

But it's pertaining specifically to the

members of the service, just so that you know, it

37
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

may -- may already be on record, but just so that

2

you know -- you know that you know it’s on record,

3

you indicated criminal acts, or what you believe are

4

criminal acts, by certain members of the service --

5

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

6

SERGEANT CHU:

7
8
9

Correct.

-- okay, and you just go

with...
ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

On Saturday, the 31st

of October, 2009, Halloween night --

10

SERGEANT CHU:

Yes.

11

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

12

SERGEANT CHU:

13

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- well, Halloween --

Yes.
-- I was at work, day

14

shift, 7:00 to 3:00, first tour.

15

Lieutenant Caughey requested my activity log.

16

Lieutenant Caughey is the integrity control officer

17

of the 81st Precinct.

18
19

SERGEANT CHU:

Is that C-o-y?

Or K-o-y?

Or do you know?

20

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

21

SERGEANT CHU:

22

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

23

SERGEANT CHU:

24

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

25

At 8:05 a.m.,

C-a-u-g-h-e-y.

Okay.
Something like that.

Okay.
Lieutenant Caughey

has previously been reported by me to Internal

38
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

Affairs for burglary regarding breaking into the

2

CO’s secretary’s personnel files and removing

3

Civilian Complaint Review Board documentation from

4

certain officers’ and supervisors’ --

5

SERGEANT CHU:

6

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

7

SERGEANT CHU:

8

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

9
10

Yeah.
-- personnel folders.

Yeah.
I guess as favors, I

don’t know, I don’t even know if it was really
investigated.

11

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

No, that -- that

12

investigation is still an active investigation, so

13

you do not have to --

14
15

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Inactive or is

active?

16

SERGEANT CHU:

Active.

17

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

18

SERGEANT CHU:

19

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

20

SERGEANT CHU:

Active.

Active?

Yes.
Okay.

So, we are aware of that

21

complaint that was made by you, so we don’t have to

22

rehash the whole complaint, as it pertains to that,

23

I just want to address --

24
25

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
that’s (inaudible) --

It was the same guy,

39
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

SERGEANT CHU:

Yes.

2

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

3

SERGEANT CHU:

4

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- (inaudible).

Okay.
For reasons of my

5

story later, Lieutenant Caughey’s gun is not

6

displayed, at this time --

7

SERGEANT CHU:

8

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

9
10
11
12
13

Okay.
-- when I -- when he

requests to sign my activity log.
SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

So he asked for your

activity log just for the purpose of (inaudible) -ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Correct.

I had been

on admin duty, T/S operator since -- since April.

14

SERGEANT CHU:

15

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

16

requested my activity log to scratch it.

17

here, you know, I keep it on me to keep notes, and

18

it's why this all happened, I believe.

19

And he took it, he kept it for three hours.

20

copies of it.

21

Lieutenant Mascol, the Operations Lieutenant of the

22

81st Precinct -- locked himself in the back office,

23

made copies of my activity log and the other

24

criminal conduct that I had been noting in there --

25

Okay.
Yeah.

He still
Okay,

He took it.
He made

He locked himself in the --

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

40
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- by supervisors in

the 81st Precinct.

3

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

4

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

He gave it to me.

I

5

noted the times on a scratch piece of paper in my

6

shirt, I didn’t bring it with me, but the times are,

7

it approximately three hours later, he gave it back to

8

me.

9

SERGEANT CHU:

10

Yeah.

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

A few minutes after

11

that, he requested Sergeant Huffman into his office.

12

Sergeant Huffman was the desk officer that day.

13

SERGEANT CHU:

14

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

15

Okay.
She was in there for

about two minutes.

16

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

17

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

When she came back

18

out, her attitude was different --

19

SERGEANT CHU:

20

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

21

Okay.
-- towards me, or

whatever.

22

SERGEANT CHU:

Can you just...

23

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

She was noted in

24

there for telling -- at roll call, stating, don’t

25

take 61s for robbery if it was a cell phone, because

41
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

they just do that to get a free cell phone, and

2

don’t do it if they don’t come back to the precinct,

3

they have to make the report at the precinct and be

4

interviewed by the squad.

5

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

6

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

7

got it back.

8

point.

9

Boston, behind me, calls me.

Okay.

So, I got -- I

Not really concerned about it, at this

I put it back in my pocket and P.A.A.
She’s in the 24 room

10

entering complaints.

She says, What’s wrong with

11

Caughey?

12

He’s walking around, he’s staring at you.

13

when I saw him again, I noticed it.

14

noticed his gun.

15

it around his gun.

16

staring at you.

I said, Well, I don’t know what you mean?
And then

And then I

He's picked up his shirt and put
And she said, Be careful, he’s

So --

17

SERGEANT CHU:

So, I presume --

18

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- I wasn’t even

19

aware of how much I had in the activity log.

I -- I

20

take it back out of my pocket and started zooming

21

through it and then I got worried.

22

no one here.

23

been noting what she’s been stating at roll calls

24

and stuff.

25

sure he already knows.

I said, there’s

Huffman, she’s in here.

She’s -- I’ve

I’ve already reported him for -- I’m
It’s not a sealed casket in

42
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

here, IAB, but...

And P.A. Boston, in the back, and

2

every once in a while an officer from the street

3

comes in to turn in paperwork, there’s no one there,

4

so I started getting more worried.

5

2:15, I don’t feel good.

6

to Sergeant Huffman, I give her a sick slip, one

7

that the TS fills out when they call over the phone.

And at about

My stomach is upset.

8

SERGEANT CHU: Yeah.

9

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I go

I give that to her, I

10

said my stomach is upset, I don’t feel good, I’m

11

going home.

12

she goes, Well, wait a minute, just wait there.

13

She’s on her cell phone.

And she --

I go downstairs, I dress down, I come back

14

to the desk.

15

good, I’m going home.

16

time, but I can’t --if you go sick, it’s line of

17

duty and we gotta fill out the paperwork.

18

just feel sick and I need to go home.

19

I’ll probably be at the hospital, but I’m gonna go

20

home first.

21

shoulders, like this, and was still talking on her

22

phone, which has a black cover on it with diamond

23

bling stickers on it.

24

desk, and filling out something.

25

Before I leave I -- I go, I don’t feel
She said, I can give you lost

And I left.

I said, I

I feel sick.

She shrugged her

She's talking on that, on the

Lieutenant -- the lieutenant that was in

43
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

the ambulance with me, after they abducted me, was

2

at the desk also, when I told her this.

3
4

SERGEANT CHU:

Yes.

And that lieutenant’s

name again is --

5

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

6

or Broschart, Blockhurst (phonetical) --

7

SERGEANT CHU:

8

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

9

Lieutenant Bratwurst

Okay.
-- or something like

that.

10

SERGEANT CHU:

Does he seem like he’s a --

11

he's a day tour lieutenant, or 4:00 to 12:00

12

lieutenant?

13

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

14

SERGEANT CHU:

4:00 to 12:00.

Okay.

Sergeant Huffman is

15

someone you regularly work with or encounter on your

16

tour?

17
18

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

from pregnancy leave like a month ago or so.

19

SERGEANT CHU:

20

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

21

I think she got back

Okay.
She's usually nice

and go, you know --

22

SERGEANT CHU: Yeah.

23

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

24
25

-- how you doing, and

stuff like that.
SERGEANT CHU:

Um-hmm.

44
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

But after she went

2

into Caughey’s office, there was no eye contact, no

3

contact the rest of the day.

4

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

So you were saying

5

that she was on her cell phone, Lieutenant

6

Bratwurst (inaudible) --

7

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I left.

I go home.

8

I started feeling better on the ride home, I’m --

9

I’m out of there.

I don’t know what was going on,

10

what was coming up, but I got out of there.

11

home, I notify IAB of what happened today, about the

12

menacing with the gun.

13

number, it was on my desk at home.

14

what’s left there, at this point.

15

SERGEANT CHU:

16

look that up.

17

I get

Now, she gave me an IAB
I don’t know

Well, you know, I could

Obviously, it’s --

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I took a NyQuil --

18

NyQuil shot for my sinuses, laid down.

19

was in my apartment flashing lights on me.

20

your hands.

21

know, what are you doing?"

22

effect.

23

go, "You’re in my house, what are you -- what are

24

you asking me?"

25

Show your hands."

Woke up, ESU
"Show

Why are you -- you

Or something to that

You know, "What’s -- what’s this about?"

Then they leave and lieutenant -- Captain

I

45
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

Lauterborn, the deputy inspector, come into my

2

bedroom and said, "Come on, let’s go."

3

I go, "Go where?"

4

They go, "You know why.

5

"Why?"
You’re coming

back to the 81."

6

I said, "I’m not going anywhere."

7

And then they leave -- well, actually,

8

Lauterborn continued to search my room.

He’s

9

touching my computer, he’s touching my cell phone,

10

he’s going through -- he’s sifting through my desk

11

and he’s scanning the room, I don’t know for a video

12

recorder or whatever.

I don’t know.

13

Now, Chief Marino enters my bedroom.

14

SERGEANT CHU:

15

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay.
He says, "Be a man,

16

get up, let’s go."

And I said, "Why am I -- why am

17

I going?"

18

same answer, "You know why, you’re coming back --

"Where am I going?"

19

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

20

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

21
22

No answer -- or the

Meanwhile --- you’re coming with

us."
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Sergeant, let me

23

interject here.

Meanwhile, I’d like to clarify this

24

statement, because I don’t know this.

25

your cell phone?

Where was

Because I am on the phone with

46
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

Adrian, at this time.

2

because when they came through the door, or after

3

they came through the door, he called me.

4

Okay.

How did that work?

I was on the phone,

They let you call?

5

did you have the phone somewhere where they didn’t

6

Or

see it?

7

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

8

they didn’t see me call you.

9

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

No, no, no, it was --

10

Okay.

11

They didn’t see.

So, I was hearing (inaudible) -ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

They didn’t see me.

12

This is when I put the recorder -- I objected --

13

well, this lieutenant, inspections lieutenant, came

14

in and said, "Are you -- are you refusing a lawful

15

order?"

16

in my bed?"

17

order?"

18
19
20
21

I go, "A lawful order in my home, sitting
He goes, "Are you refusing a lawful

I said, "Fine, I’ll go, but I’m objecting.

I’m going against my will."
He said, "Fine, put your clothes on."
Blah, blah, blah.
I put my pants on.

I get my recorder, the

22

black one, I described there, put it in my pocket,

23

and I'm holding the phone in my hand and I walk out.

24

I walk out.

25

I see my neighbors all standing out, an ESU truck,

I get to the street, I see the street,

47
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

the CO’s unmarked SUV is blocking off 88th Place, my

2

block, and Lieutenant Crawford is on his cell phone

3

at the corner of 88th Place and Myrtle Avenue.

4

tell him what’s going on.

5

them.

6

said, "I'll go to the hospital on my own, thank you,

7

but I'm leaving."

9

He says, don't go with

And I -- I -- I agreed with that.

8

I

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

And I

I'd like to interject

here, and the only reason I'm doing this, Sergeant,

10

is because I was hearing this, okay, because the

11

cell phone was on the phone.

12

with him.

13

SERGEANT CHU:

14

LARRY

15

SERGEANT CHU: Yes.

16

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

I was on the phone

17

Yes.

SCHOOLCRAFT:

So I could hear this.

Not only did I hear

it, but it was being recorded.

18

SERGEANT CHU:

Yes.

19

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

The reason it was

20

being recorded is because I had everything hooked up

21

to my deal because Lauterborn, the duty captain from

22

Brooklyn North, was calling me, intimidating me,

23

making threats to me to make my son come outside,

24

okay --

25

SERGEANT CHU:

Yes.

48
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- and that if I

2

didn't get him to come out, they were coming in and

3

things were gonna get bad.

4

up.

5

SERGEANT CHU:

6

Okay.

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

So I was hooked

Okay.
So, when Adrian called

7

me, this -- I not only was -- so I'm not only the

8

complainant, I'm a witness.

9

SERGEANT CHU:

10
11

LARRY
there.

SCHOOLCRAFT:

SERGEANT CHU:
witness.

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

15

SERGEANT CHU:

16

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

18
19

Sergeant.

Excellent.

I did not know that.
SERGEANT CHU:

Thank you,

I'm an ear witness.

Do you recall what time the

initial call was made to you?
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

21

SERGEANT CHU:

23

The ear witness?

Yes.

20

22

Because I was

It's what we call an ear

14

17

Okay.

I wasn’t there physically --

12
13

Yeah.

Yes?

By Lauterborn?
Or by anybody, was

it, if not by Lauterborn?
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Well, Lauterborn, I

24

would -- I mean, this is off the top, because

25

there's been a thousand phone calls.

49
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

SERGEANT CHU:

2

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

3

I understand.
We can verify it,

too.

4

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Yeah.

This is all --

5

you know, that’s the great thing about this system

6

today, everything is documented, you know.

7

SERGEANT CHU:

8

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

9

Yeah.
He called me and left

a message on my voice machine, and I was out, okay.

10

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

11

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

And I did not call

12

back, I wanted to get hooked up, so I went home, got

13

connected, then I called him back.

14

SERGEANT CHU:

15
16

left?

But what was the message

What was the (inaudible) -LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

The message was,

17

basically, Adrian didn't fill out paperwork properly

18

and he needs to come back to work.

19

SERGEANT CHU:

20

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay.
The paperwork here is

21

stating that, the doctor wrote, that I got into an

22

argument at work and I left.

23

SERGEANT CHU:

24

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

25

Okay.
But Captain

Lauterborn, he verified to him that he did -- that I

50
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

did at least fill out something, where I was, where

2

I was going, my home --

3

SERGEANT CHU:

4

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT: -- and why, because it

5

Yes.

was my stomach.

6

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

I told the captain, I

7

said, Adrian told me at 2:00, at -- you know, I

8

don’t know now whether I told Lieutenant -- Captain

9

Lauterborn what was going on with Caughey and him,

10

because Lauterborn is dirty, 100 percent, and I knew

11

that.

12

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

He threatened me last

13

time I reported -- I called the duty captain when

14

Lieutenant Caughey took my memo book again.

15

was on foot post -- he -- he just -- he had just

16

wrote me up for going to the bathroom.

17

memo book and he took off again leaving me out on

18

the street.

19

radio.

20

Lauterborn.

21

conversation, saying, it is what it is, it's only

22

gonna get worse.

23

he does that.

24
25

He took my

I requested the duty captain via the

Guess who the duty captain was?

Captain

Again, it was about a 40-minute

And that was -- that was -- it's

SERGEANT CHU:
mean?

He -- I

What did he do?

Well -- well, what do you

51
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

He says

it's only gonna get worse.

3
4

Threatens.

SERGEANT CHU:

What did you infer that --

what did you interpret that as?

5

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I have no idea.

6

would he -- how he could make it worse than it

7

How

already was, other than to harm me, physically.

8
9
10

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

something about, do you like coming in here to work
everyday?

11

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

12

stomach upset?

13

that, do you?

14

worse.

15
16

Well, didn't he say

He said, Is your

Are you feeling bad?
(Inaudible).

You don’t want

It's only gonna get

He said, It's only gonna get worse.
SERGEANT CHU:

Oh, but this is going back

some time, correct --

17

LARRY

18

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

19

SERGEANT CHU:

20

some reference about --

21

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Six months, March?
March.

-- when he made -- made

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

22

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

It's all

documented too, and recorded.

23

Yeah.

Okay.

So, we're at,

24

I'm walking back to my house, I unlock the front

25

door, go in, Lauterborn pushes his way in.

I'm

52
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

trying to close the door, he pushes his way in, I

2

don't resist.

3

door.

4

one was in there this time.

I walk up to my apartment, unlock the

No one's in there.

The lights were out.

5

SERGEANT CHU:

6

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

7

the door, Lauterborn pushes his way in.

8

bedroom, lay down on the bed.

9

phone, I'm talking to him.

No

Yeah.
I go in, try to shut
I go to the

He's still on the

They're in my living

10

room.

11

They're in there for about two minutes, getting it

12

together.

13

a man and come with us?"

14

statement that I heard from him --

15

SERGEANT CHU:

16

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

17

talked.

18
19

They don't come right into my bedroom.

Marino comes in, says, "Are you gonna be
Similar to the first

Yeah.
-- the first time he

"Are you gonna be a man and come with us?"
I said, "I don't feel well, I'm not going

anywhere."

20

"So you're not coming with us?"

21

I said, "I don't feel well, I'm staying

22

right here."

23

He -- he did this.

24

it."

25

head, the neck --

Do it.

He said, "Do

And then, I was just grabbed, by the hair, the

53
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

2

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- my arms, legs.

3

And I had someone heavy stomping on my legs.

4

then my back, they weren't as heavy, but they were

5

digging in.

6

had me in a torture position, like this, not

7

handcuffing me.

8
9

And

And they were grabbing my arms, they

SERGEANT CHU:

Do you recall, you said you

had some bruising on your -- the bottom of your left

10

upper arm; do you recall who was grabbing you at

11

that time?

12

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Every -- I know the

13

unidentified black male, the bald one, with the

14

lieutenant --

15

SERGEANT CHU:

16

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

17

Yes.
-- inspections

Lieutenant Gough --

18

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

19

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- I definitely saw

20

them.

But after I -- when Marino noticed I was

21

looking up and I could actually see them --

22

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

23

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- that's when he --

24

he stepped on my face and then -- and then made sure

25

his boot was covering my eyes.

54
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

SERGEANT CHU:

You indicated ESU did the

initial entry --

3

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

4

SERGEANT CHU:

5

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Correct.

-- ESU officers?
But I didn't -- the

6

next time I saw an ESU officer, there was one, his

7

name was Barbella (phonetical) or Barbara

8

(phonetical) or something like that.

9

only reason I know that is because he was in front

10

He was -- the

of me when they were carrying me down the stairs.

11

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

12

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

But I believe the

13

inspections lieutenant was the one behind me,

14

carrying me.

15
16
17
18

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

When you say

carrying, in what manner were they carrying you?
ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

It was a -- it was

the orange --

19

SERGEANT CHU:

Chair?

20

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

21

SERGEANT CHU:

22

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- ESU chair.

Okay.
I'm okay, I'm on the

23

ground, they stomp on me.

It feels like forever to

24

put the cuffs on and when they finally do, I -- it's

25

even worse than what the arm thing they were doing,

55
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

they're twisting and pulling --

2

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

3

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

4

on my arm while they were stretched out.

5

finally handcuffed me.

6

while the black bald guy is searching through my

7

pockets.

8

his hand, he gives it to Marino, Chief Marino, who

9

was sitting on my bed.

-- and like stomping
They

I hear someone sit on my bed

They roll me over, he has the recorder in

10

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

11

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

He said, "Oh, he's

12

being cute.

All right, search him for -- he's got

13

recording devices, search him."

14

everything.

15

underwear, he found the recorder, my keys.

16

him my keys.

17

gave them to someone.

18

and then they didn't fall down or get placed on

19

something, they went into a pocket somewhere, like,

20

grabbed.

And they search

The black guy was reaching down in my

I think it was the lieutenant.

He gave
He

And they jingled for a second

They didn't make noise anymore.

21

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

22

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

But I couldn't see

23

who that was, all I could see was (indiscernible).

24

I see Marino lay the recorder on the shelf, next to

25

my bed.

As they're lifting me up, he looks at it

56
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

again, takes it with his left hand, puts it in his

2

right hand, then puts it in the right side of his

3

uniform jacket --

4

SERGEANT CHU: Okay.

5

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- pocket.

And

6

that's –- then they had me kneel in front of him,

7

handcuffed, him sitting on my bed, and he makes some

8

statement like, "All we're trying to do is help you,

9

Adrian," something like that.

And he was smirking

10

while he was saying it.

11

"I never thought I'd live to see the day where I'm

12

locking up a cop."

13

after that, the bald black guy said, "I've never

14

seen anything like this in 16 years."

15

Then -- oh, he also said,

He said that.

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

And a little

But, all right, so

16

now it's -- you can proceed.

At this point, now,

17

you were being -- you were carried down in one of

18

those orange chairs.

19

And you're one flight up.

20

directly into the ambulance.

21

had indicated there was a -- one of the lieutenants

22

or the Sergeant James was escorting you in the

23

ambulance or by the ambulance?

How many flights are you up?
And you're brought

24

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

25

SERGEANT CHU:

And then I think you

No, the lieutenant.

The lieutenant.

57
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Sergeant James

relieved the lieutenant.

3

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay, Lieutenant Bratwurst.

4

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I didn't have a face

5

of a clock facing me, so I don't know the exact

6

times.

7
8

SERGEANT CHU:

That fine.

That's good

enough.

9

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

But Sergeant James

10

relieved Lieutenant Bratwurst, who also refused my

11

request to contact IAB.

12

SERGEANT CHU:

13

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay.
And Sergeant James --

14

and the loosening of the cuffs, which was causing

15

numbness later on.

16
17

SERGEANT CHU:

Sergeant James relieved the

lieutenant while you were already at the hospital?

18

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

19

SERGEANT CHU:

20

lieutenant was the one that was --

Okay.

Correct.
So, but the

21

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

22

SERGEANT CHU: -- in the ambulance with you,

23

over to, you were brought here, directly, Jamaica

24

Hospital?

25

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

In the ambulance.

Correct.

58
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

SERGEANT CHU:

2

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

3

Okay.

Forest Hills, but they --

4

SERGEANT CHU:

5

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

6

Okay.
-- that's not a city

hospital, I guess.

7
8

I had requested

SERGEANT CHU:
is, actually.

9

Yeah, I don't believe it

Offhand, I don't really know.

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

10

SERGEANT CHU:

12

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

They had to

have control over this.

11

Yeah.

13
14

Yeah.
The -- I just wanna

note that Lieutenant Bratwurst, on the cuffs -SERGEANT CHU:

15

Uh-huh.

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- the unnecessary

16

use of force.

And Sergeant James, unnecessary use

17

of force.

18

again, I was trying to use the phone, Sergeant

19

Sawyer arrived sometime early in the morning

20

Sunday --

Sergeant Sawyer, when they relieved --

21

SERGEANT CHU:

Um-hmm.

22

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- decided to double

23

cuff me, cuff both my hands.

Police Officer Miller,

24

Officer Saworski and a couple cops from the 102, I

25

think, helped them.

They -- again, it was kinda

59
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

like similar, they all grabbed me and --

2

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

3

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Double cuffed.
-- double cuffed me.

4

And they did it even better than they did in my own

5

home.

6

loosened.

7

it, reluctantly.

The doctor did tell them, that has to be
And they did.

Officer Miller loosened

8

SERGEANT CHU:

9

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

10

Okay.

And the request for

IAB --

11

SERGEANT CHU:

12

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

13

Now, you were --

Okay.
-- from both Sergeant

James, Lieutenant Bratwurst.

14

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

15

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

And Officer Miller

16

and Officer -- or Sergeant Sawyer, both armed,

17

they're not in uniform.

18

SERGEANT CHU:

19

And you said they are from

the 102?

20

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

No.

Those -- I don't

21

know who the other officer -- she was recruiting

22

officers to help molest me and hold me down and keep

23

me under control, when all I wanted was a phone

24

call.

25

Nurse Lynn is a witness.

Lynn and Dr.

60
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

Syrus or Cyrus, something like that.

2

how she spells her name Lynn, but Nurse Lynn.

3

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

I don't know

Doc -- Sergeant, I'd

4

like to interject here, too.

5

the hospital, because since I heard that they hauled

6

him off, it took me a few hours to find him, okay,

7

and then being Halloween night, getting through on

8

the phone was a nightmare --

9

SERGEANT CHU:

10

After I found him at

Yeah.

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- I kept getting hung

11

up on, get redirected, or they were so busy nobody

12

could talk to me, okay --

13

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

14

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- but I was able to

15

contact, luckily, a sergeant in a security

16

department.

17

I got to a sergeant, I explained what was going on.

18

So he said, "I'll go up and I'll find out what's

19

going on."

20

nurse to call me.

21

Lynn, this one he's talking about.

She called me

22

and she told me what was going on.

And she told me

23

that he was being intimidated, they were

24

intimidating the staff, the doctors and the nurses

25

were scared.

I called and I tried to go that route.

He went up and he was able to get a
And this nurse, I believe, was

The cops were -- cops were running the

61
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

show.

2

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

3

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

4

the show, nobody was secure.

5

-- I got the security director to call the

6

administrator.

7

laying down pretty good.

8

the hospital administrator.

9

the hospital administrator told him, it's a police

The cops are running
Because I said, see, I

It gets so heavy.

I mean, I was

He got scared, he called
And he told -- he said

10

deal, we've got nothing to do with it.

11

that administrator it's their hospital and if he's

12

in medical care, that doctor's the one that should

13

have had them -- I was a police officer 20 years,

14

I've been in the emergency room a lot with a lot of

15

people, if that doctor tells you to take those cuffs

16

off because it is hurting the patient and he needs

17

to provide services, you have to remove them, unless

18

it's a threatening situation.

19

violent or threatening.

20
21

Okay.
I was protesting that

I -- why can't I use the phone.
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Right.

They wouldn't

let him use the phone.

24
25

He wasn't being

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

22
23

I said tell

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
anyone.

I wasn't fighting

62
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

When Lynn -- Sergeant

2

James is a female, about this tall -- when Lynn

3

would try to get the phone to him, I'd have officers

4

hang up on me.

5

hang up.

They put him incommunicado, so he could

6

not talk.

And she said they were intimidating,

7

they're intimidating the staff, they wouldn't

8

letting them talk to each other.

9

to eat, drink, and he was not allowed to go to the

10

He wasn't allowed

bathroom, he had to pee in a cup.

11
12

They'd take the phone from him and

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I asked another

patient to get me water and he did.

13

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

And he had to pee in a

14

cup.

15

she said his handcuff -- his hand was swelling up

16

and turning blue, but they would not lower the cuff.

17

And I said, Were the doctors aware of that?

18

said they've intimidated them.

19

gonna do it.

20

And they would not take his handcuffs -- and

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

And she

They -- they're not

Sergeant Sawyer, I

21

don't recall requesting IAB from him, but he is

22

unnecessary use of force.

23

SERGEANT CHU:

24

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

25

unnecessary use of force.

Okay.
Unlawful detainment,

He bought into it.

63
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

SERGEANT CHU:

Why -- was there any reason you

2

-- and I'm not indicating one way or the other

3

that they should have or shouldn't have -- but was

4

there any reason that you -- was it to your

5

understanding why, when Sergeant Sawyer arrived, why

6

he double cuffed you?

7

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

He said why -- why

8

you letting the perp use the phone?

And then --

9

then I think I relayed that to you, what he was

10

saying.

11

wasn't making it out, I was on the phone with him

12

and he --

13

And Sergeant James said something, but I

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

I asked to speak to

14

the sergeant.

15

speak to one of the supervisors there, and she

16

wouldn't talk to me.

17
18

I asked to speak to them, could I

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

He goes, He's not

supposed to be on the phone.

19

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

20

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

And I told him what

21

he was saying, and he overheard me saying that, and

22

then it was --

23

SERGEANT CHU:

Well, when you were -- you

24

were -- at the time you were cuffed, you were cuffed

25

to what?

64
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

2

SERGEANT CHU:

3

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

4

A gurney.

SERGEANT CHU:

6

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

8
9
10
11
12
13

But I was out of the

gurney --

5

7

A gurney.

Okay.
-- and standing up,

holding the phone.
SERGEANT CHU:
phone, I presume?

Okay.

Was it the pay

Or like a --

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

It was -- no, it

wasn't a pay phone.
SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

It was one like the

phone like on the wall right there, almost?

14

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

15

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

And then, when you say,

16

"double cuff," you meant they cuffed your other --

17

your free hand?

18
19
20

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I was cuffed like

this, the other side of the gurney.
SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

All right.

What

21

were -- what was the lieutenant and sergeant's

22

response to you, when you requested --

23

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

24

even said a word to me.

25

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

No response.

No one

65
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- other than when

she was telling me to get off the phone --

3

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

4

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- and stuff like

5

that.

6

they even -- Sergeant James even snickered.

7

But, no, when I requested IAB, they just --

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

And this was -- as

8

you were saying, I think, now you were saying now, I

9

think we're going to Sunday morning with Sergeant

10

Sawyer getting there, right?

11

with Sergeant Scott, was it yesterday, I believe, or

12

Monday?

Well, today's Wednesday --

13

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

14

SERGEANT CHU:

15
16

And I think you met

Wednesday.

-- was it Monday?

I think,

you met (inaudible) -ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I think it was Monday

17

night, (inaudible) when he came.

18

Monday night.

19

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

I think it was

Do you have any

20

other specific allegations as it pertains to any

21

officers, other than what you already described,

22

because I want to make sure that we capture your --

23

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Sergeant, let me

24

clarify -- and the only reason I'm saying this is,

25

I'm not trying to live vicariously through my son,

66
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

the last thing I wanna do is get involved in any

2

more police work, okay --

3

SERGEANT CHU:

4

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

5

Yeah.
-- but, I'm in this,

okay --

6

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

7

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- because I was his

8

only I guess you call a lifeline.

9

he can trust.

Okay.

10

SERGEANT CHU:

11

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

12

Yeah.
So he can, like any

good father or son, he's gonna confide in me.

13

SERGEANT CHU:

14

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

15

I'm the only one

Yeah.
So I'm privy to a lot

of this.

16

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

17

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Adrian's been telling

18

me for the last year what's been going on in the

19

department.

20

SERGEANT CHU:

21

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

22
23
24
25

Okay.
Okay.

All the stuff

going on.
ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

(Inaudible) going on

in the department.
LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Right.

Well, it is

67
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

the department, regardless of what part of the

2

department, it is the NYPD.

3

systemic, chronic problem.

4

and I believe it's systemic, department-wide.

5
6

I believe it's a
I believe it's chronic

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

But if it's not, it's

just a minority (inaudible) --

7

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Yeah.

Yeah, exactly,

8

then it's a minority issue.

But I don't believe

9

it's just a minority issue.

But that's a personal

10

opinion.

11

I told Adrian that I thought the best

12

thing for him to do was just, let's leave.

I wanted

13

to move him to New Mexico.

14

30 years, died a horrible death of cancer.

15

came up from Texas.

16

of Texas after he got out of the Navy.

17

working for Motorola, he got a great job, going to

18

the University of Texas, he was thinking about

19

becoming a doctor, and he's smart, he's talented.

20

And I'm not just saying it's my kid, he's just a

21

good kid.

22

He's normal.

23

likes movies and reading books and he's just normal.

24

I mean, there's no anything about him.

25

been close.

His mother, my wife of
Adrian

He was going to the University

He doesn't drink.
He's funny.

He was

He doesn't smoke.

He's quiet.

But he just

We've always

I said, Adrian, look, you're never

68
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

gonna take on something like the NYPD.

2

SERGEANT CHU:

Right.

3

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay.

I fought it 20

4

years; I was a labor leader, I was a delegate for

5

the AFL-CIO, I was a president of the local.

6

got a degree in criminal justice, I got an advanced

7

certificate in law enforcement from the State of

8

Texas, I was on the board of directors in CLEAT,

9

which was the largest police union in the State of

I've

10

Texas.

Again, I was the president of my own local.

11

I've sat on boards and I've testified in many

12

hearings all the way to the Texas Supreme Court,

13

both on the civil and the criminal side.

14

testified for grand juries.

15

there.

I've

You know, I've been

That's all I'm saying.

16

So, I told Adrian, look, you're -- you're

17

never gonna take them on.

I reached out for him

18

trying to get councilmen involved, trying to get

19

community leaders involved, trying to get the ACLU

20

involved.

21

involving the NYPD.

22

culture and the background of the NYPD, which I

23

hadn't really brought up to you, going back almost

24

40 years, I don't know if your familiar with the --

25

the book Target Blue by Robert Daley?

I started studying up.

Buying books

Just everything.

Learning the

69
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

SERGEANT CHU:

I've heard of the title.

I

can't -- I don't have any --

3

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

4

You're an NYPD detective.

5

because I'm from New York State, I grew up in New

6

York State, I'm not a city boy, I'm an upstate boy.

So I was very familiar

7

SERGEANT CHU:

8

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

9

You ought to get it.

Yeah.
But I grew up in the

60's and the 70's and I was very familiar with the

10

NYPD.

My father worked at General Electric for 40

11

years, then he went to serve in World War II, came

12

back, went back -- back to worked for General

13

Electric and every day, like clock work, my father

14

brought home a Daily News and set it in our little

15

country farmhouse.

16

on New York City.

Okay.

So, I was very up to date

17

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

18

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

So, my wife -- when I

19

went to service, my wife got me Target Blue.

20

got me Target Blue, when it came out, by Robert

21

Daley.

22

then in, you know, the whole Ed Eagan and all that

23

stuff.

24
25

And I read it.

She

And I was very interested

Well, I told Adrian, you know, it's -it's -- I started studying up and getting caught up

70
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

to contemporary times on what's going on in the New

2

York police and everything, and when I started

3

talking to people in the community and everything, I

4

found out that Adrian's -- Adrian's issues,

5

everybody is aware of them, and those are the issues

6

of zero tolerance.

7

collars, collars, collars, collars.

8

NYPD lingo.

9

The zero tolerance.

SERGEANT CHU:

10

Collars,

And I'm using

Yeah.

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Collars, collars,

11

collars.

Summonses, summonses, summonses,

12

summonses.

13

ticket, tickets, tickets.

14

fake tickets.

15

Nobody checks them.

16

All about numbers.

17

numbers.

18

you don't want felonies, down grade them.

19

major felony theft, you get it below where it's a

20

misdemeanor.

21

those.

22

rid of them.

23

goes out into the precinct and says -- tells the

24

community leaders, you have problems, you can call,

25

call the precinct.

No discretion.

Just arrest.
250s.

Fake 250s.

Write them to anybody.

Fake 61s.

Tickets,
Write

Turn them in.

And it was a zero tolerance.
All about CompStat.
Downgrading 61s.

Just
You wanna -If it's a

Grand theft auto, can't have any of

You down grade and you shit can them to get
Your head goes out -- the commander

Call the precinct.

Why they

71
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

call the precinct?

2

precinct.

3

Nothing's recorded in the

So if the call comes in and says, tells

4

the 81 that my car was stolen, okay, if they send --

5

if, if they send a car out, okay, the report is

6

either they're not gonna take it, they're gonna try

7

to nullify the victim, or a supervisor, a sergeant/

8

lieutenant is going to show up and they're gonna put

9

an X to that complaint.

They're gonna do away with

10

it or they're gonna down grade it.

11

This goes on

everyday, on every call.

12

Also, forget about calling the police, if

13

they're busy writing tickets, they don't respond to

14

the calls.

15

citizens.

16

Arresting guys in the station house for bringing in

17

a gun.

18

warrant or something.

19

nothing.

20

his safety, when you start doing this, when you

21

start picking your head up and start looking at

22

stuff everybody knows what's going on, so it was

23

very dangerous, and where this all came about is

24

when he decided instead of us going to New Mexico,

25

he had to stay, he couldn't walk away, he wanted --

They neglect calls for service of
They don't go.

Okay.

Amnesty arrests.

I said, Adrian, they had to have had a

Nothing.

We checked some of them,

Checked the reports, again, at

72
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

he wanted to do what he could do, which I

2

desperately tried to talk him out of, I told him,

3

you would be in danger, and he chose to go this

4

route.

5

I reached out to a friend of mine, retired

6

Detective Lieutenant David Durk.

David got

7

involved.

8

with us on this.

9

David Durk was helping Adrian a couple weeks ago and

He counseled Adrian and me.

He worked

And I believe that it leaked that

10

this is what brought this on.

11

believe now from what I'm hearing in my contacts in

12

the department, that this was a leak somewhere in

13

internal affairs and that's what brought this about.

14

That is what I

And, notice, this was kept to a command

15

all the way up to the Brooklyn North Command.

Okay.

16

I believe that Commander Mauriello, Steven

17

Mauriello, the deputy inspector, commander of the

18

81, he's known Adrian was a problem for a long time.

19

This is well documented.

20

watching them.

21

They know Adrian was recording them.

22

was going on.

23

trying to deal with it himself, but he didn't know

24

what to do.

25

to people in the command and want -- and asked, what

They know Adrian was

They know Adrian was watching them.
They knew what

He had let everything slide.

He was

In fact, he brought -- he reached out

73
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

do I do about Schoolcraft?

What do I do about

2

Schoolcraft?

3

he had to pick up the phone and call what I believe

4

is his Rabbi in the department and that's Marino.

5

think now we verified who Mauriello's Rabbi was and

6

that was Marino.

Marino had to come and help his

7

little boy out.

Marin-- Mauriello is about to get

8

promoted to inspector.

9

They're moving up the ladder together.

He was trying to get help.

Finally,

I

Marino is his Rabbi.
Marino got

10

involved.

11

hiding and Marino went and got him out, just like a

12

gangster -- Central Park 450 --

13

I believe that night, Mauriello was

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

There was -- there

14

was another male there that I would -- I can

15

recognize.

16
17

I think he was a retired -DR. ISAKOV:

Can I interrupt you for a

minute?

18

SERGEANT CHU:

19

DR. ISAKOV:

20

SERGEANT CHU:

Yes.

Absolutely.

How long it will take?
I believe we should

21

actually -- it shouldn't take more than another 10

22

minutes or so before I think I pretty much addressed

23

his -- I captured the -- the major components of his

24

complaint that we have to address.

25

just permit about another 10 minutes or so, we could

So, if you could

74
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

be --

2
3

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

we bring Christine McMahon back in here?

4

DR. ISAKOV:

5

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

6

DR. ISAKOV:

7

Which one?
Christine McMahon.

I will see if she's still

here.

8
9

In 10 minutes, could

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
could stay around.

10

Okay.

Ask her if she

I'll pay her overtime.

Anyways, just like some gangsters and

11

little kids in Central Park, they decide they're

12

gonna jump on some little female jogger, okay, and

13

then you got the -- you got the one out of the gang

14

that's kinda stepping back, and then the other kids

15

go, hey, you get in on this too.

16

what Marino did that night --

17

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

And that's just

There was another

18

male there hiding behind the ESU truck with

19

Mauriello.

20

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

21

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Everybody -He was in

22

plainclothes.

He was an older guy.

I could

23

recognize him.

24

North building, they have this brand new plaque set

25

up, and I think I was just looking at his photo a

I think his photo is in the Brooklyn

75
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

couple days earlier, when I was seeing Sergeant

2

Devino about my appeal, and I think he's a retired

3

somebody from Brooklyn North.

4

the one, the orchestrator of this, who said, this is

5

what you do.

6

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

7

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

8

SERGEANT CHU:

9

The architect.
Yeah.

Now, you saw like this

picture, like in the (inaudible) --

10
11

And I think that's

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I can identify him if

I see his picture, I can remember who he was.

12

SERGEANT CHU:

So he may be -- he may be

13

an active member then, right, and you said you saw

14

his picture?

15

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I don't think.

16

think he's retired.

17

reading, when I was reading the thing.

18

very familiar face.

19

dirty.

20

I

I think that's what I was

with --

It's gruffy, but it's not

It's -- he has kind of it looks like a beard

21

SERGEANT CHU:

22

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

23

SERGEANT CHU:

24

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

25

He has a

Yeah.
-- thin glasses on.

Okay.
And I just wanna --

Lieutenant Crawford's nickname is The Shredder.

76
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

There is a cartoon inside the 81st Precinct crime

2

office --

3

SERGEANT CHU:

Uh-huh.

4

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- or at the last

5

time I was in there -- of a paper shredder and his

6

face is on it.

7

lieutenant.

8

rid of complaints.

9

He's the special operations

He's known as the shredder for getting

SERGEANT CHU:

I'm -- just out of

10

curiosity, when did -- when did you serve your time

11

in law enforcement, sir?

12
13

LARRY

Well, actually, from

'75 to 2001.

14
15

SCHOOLCRAFT:

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

Which -- which

agency?

16

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Several.

First, I

17

started out in the military and I was in military

18

police investigations.

19

I went to work for the Austin Police Department.

20

From the Austin Police Department, I went to work

21

for the University Park Police Department in Dallas.

22

After that, I was in the Fort Worth Marshal's

23

Office.

24
25

SERGEANT CHU:
out of curiosity.

When I got out of the Army,

Okay.

I just wanted, just

77
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

2

SERGEANT CHU:

3

LARRY

4

SERGEANT CHU: You had relayed to Adrian

5

about wanting -- that you believed that he should have

6

removed himself from the department, or talked about

7

going to New Mexico out of --

Thank you.

SCHOOLCRAFT:

8

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

9

SERGEANT CHU:

10

LARRY

Oh.

Glad to tell you.

Right.

I was --

-- just out of concern?

SCHOOLCRAFT:

I was just saying,

11

you can't -- you're just gonna be miserable.

You're

12

gonna -- it's gonna be terrible.

13

I've done it for 20 years, tried to bring change and

14

tried to -- the biggest thing that's always

15

concerning to me is, I thought I had worked in

16

hostile environments.

17

officer, I've worked in departments that were great.

18

Okay.

19

in departments that were very -- that your working

20

environment was great and I've worked in ones that

21

were nightmares.

22

he is, it's a nightmare.

23

that environment for very long.

24

don't think there is an officer down there that'll

25

tell you, it's not the stuff outside, it's the stuff

And, you know,

I've worked -- as a police

I -- I've worked in the military.

I worked

And the NYPD's a nightmare.

Where

A person can't live in
You can't.

And I

78
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

inside.

2

streets of any precinct in New York City.

3

It's stressful.

4

your own people and to work in such an unfriendly

5

work environment that they create, they create this

6

mess.

7

an atmosphere exist that breeds corruption, just

8

like a hot house grows flowers.

9

believe that's the problem.

10
11

And we already know how bad it is on the
Okay.

But then for it to be compounded by

I believe they create an -- they -- they let

I told him this.

And I believe -- I

I tried to dissuade it.

And as he was --

12

SERGEANT CHU:

13

LARRY

Were -- were --

SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- I didn't mean to

14

-- as he mulling on this, they gave him a bad

15

evaluation.

16

I'm clear, and I've -- I've tried to bring myself up

17

to policy, I have every -- I have the patrol guide,

18

I have the administrative guide, the organizational

19

guide, I have every book I could get my hands on,

20

I've studied everything, I've studied New York State

21

labor law, and I studied civil service law, New York

22

City civil service law and I have tried to bring

23

myself -- and New York City charter -- and I've

24

tried to bring myself up quickly to speed, so I know

25

what was going on -- and I got to back up, what was

And the strange thing about this is, if

79
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

I talking about, once I went down that road?

2
3

SERGEANT CHU:

About just, you know,

bringing yourself up to speed through all of this.

4

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Oh.

He got a -- he

5

got a bad evaluation and, you know, this was right

6

during the time that we were getting ready to, you

7

know, make a move.

8

you can't go and try to apply to another department

9

with a bad evaluation, you know, it will haunt you,

And I said, Adrian, you can't --

10

so I told him to appeal it.

11

it, everything started to happen.

12

SERGEANT CHU:

13

What time -- what time

frame was --

14
15

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

SERGEANT CHU:

17

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- (inaudible)?

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

22

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

24
25

They put signs on my

doors (inaudible) --

21

23

-- the -- he got

his --

19
20

Well, this is the

interesting thing, sergeant --

16

18

And after he appealed

Right.
-- in the locker

room.
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
on January 29th of this year.

He got his evaluation
And when I looked --

80
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

and I could be wrong on this, but from memory, I've

2

got a lot of stuff in my head -- I believe that

3

evaluations are supposed to be completed before --

4

between January 15th and -- I mean December 15th and

5

January 15th, okay, and if they're not, then there

6

is a policy that you have to -- the commander has to

7

tell somebody why.

8

is a substandard employee, okay, they give him a

9

2.5, but if you add up his scores, it's a 3.75, they

Okay.

So they're saying Adrian

10

say he's substandard and he's been counseled and he

11

needs all this stuff, but yet there's no monthly --

12

I mean quarterly evaluations detailing Adrian's, you

13

know, deficiencies.

14

There's no counseling of anything.

15

monthlies, nothing's documented on those.

16

if you've got a deficient employee and you've got

17

four weeks, four weeks to evaluate him, wouldn't he

18

be the first one you would evaluate? Okay.

19

15th wouldn't you cut him an evaluation?

20

didn't do it the first day of December 15th, they

21

didn't do it the last day of January 15th, they

22

waited two more weeks, so six weeks, two weeks

23

beyond the maximum time they're allowed to do an

24

evaluation, six weeks to give an employee a

25

substandard evaluation.

There's no counseling slips.

Okay.

On his
And why,

December
No.

They

81
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

2

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

And they rely on it.
And then -- and then

3

after that, he got signs on the door, Mauriello was

4

heard in the hallway -- because he appealed --

5

Mauriello was heard saying to somebody -- we've got

6

all these names and everything, I'm just telling you

7

the story real quick -- he said, Stukes screwed up

8

-- Stukes is the Sergeant -- he screwed up, what am

9

I supposed to do with this?

What am I supposed to

10

do?

He gets a sign on his locker saying, Get

11

another job, you know, and that sign is still there.

12

He's getting -- he gets put on foot patrol in the

13

cold, in the hot, whatever it is, he gets.

14

gets --

15
16

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

He

They took my gun and

shield pretty quick after that.

17

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Right.

They took his

18

gun and shield in April because he was having

19

stomach problems.

20

go to LeFrak.

21

day or two every once in (indiscernible), but, you

22

know, he has an impeccable sick record.

23

so they send him to LeFrak and Dr. Lamstein takes

24

his shield and gun and to this day she has not told

25

him why.

Okay.

So, of course, he has to

They can't give him admin sick for a

Okay.

Now,

82
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

Now, they'll all tell you now they told

2

him, but evidently he's too embarrassed to tell me.

3

Okay.

4

writing.

5

Nothing in writing.

6

file.

I said, fine, put it in writing.
No.

Put it in

She will not put anything in writing.
She won't let him see his

7

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

8

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

I saw her.
You know, she saw him

9

last week, that file's laying right there -- and

10

this is all recorded, this is all documented, so

11

this isn't just me, we have this, this is evidence

12

-- he asked to see your file -- his file sitting

13

right there on the desk, right next to him, she

14

would not let him see it.

15

fine, can I read it?

16

is property of the NYPD.

17

writing?

18

wouldn't give it to him.

19

take his shield and gun.

20

No.

She says -- he says,

No, you cannot read it, this
Can I have my diagnosis in

What's my treatment plan?

I've asked.

Nothing.

She

All they do is

I called the deputy mayor of

21

operations, okay, and I've talked to the

22

commissioner's office, he's had no clear cut --

23

after they took the shield and gun and put him on

24

modified duty, restricted duty, whatever you wanna

25

call it, nobody has counseled him and told him what

83
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

his duties are now.

2

non-sworn.

3

do?

4

him down at the 81, they've got him making arrests

5

in the precinct house --

6
7

I mean, what is he supposed to

So if this is a psychological issue, they got

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Forced arrest,

vouchering loaded firearms that people find.

8
9

Okay.

Duties of sworn, okay, versus

LARRY
arms.

Okay.

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Handling loaded fire

Now, this is all documented,

10

photographed and documented.

11

All again, David Durk orchestrated it, architected

12

it, told us what to do.

13

photographed, recorded.

14
15
16
17
18
19
20

This is all evidence.

It's all been documented,

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

It's all gonna be a

report to the commissioner.
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

We were gonna -- he

was gonna do a report to the commissioner.
ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I am gonna do a

report to the commissioner.
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Yeah, we are.

We are.

21

But that's what this was all gonna be on.

22

study and a report to the commissioner.

23

what got out, they couldn't let this to happen, they

24

had to discredit --

25

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

A year's
This is

I don't think they

84
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

knew about the report.

2
3

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
They didn't.

4

No, they didn't know.

But they could not let --

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

They knew -- they

5

knew about Caughey and the report and the 61s being

6

trashed.

7

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

I feel now, with what

8

happened, they had to have somehow been monitoring

9

our phones or something --

10
11
12
13
14

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

They get crazy with

it.
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

No.

Or they placed a

-- they knew too much information, I mean -SERGEANT CHU:

All right.

Just so I -- I

15

don't profess to know everything and everyone, but

16

Durk is, he was, at one time -- who is he?

17
18

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
detective lieutenant.

19

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

20

SERGEANT CHU:

21

Lieutenant.

Retired Lieutenant.

Is it

D-i-r-k or --

22

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

23

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

24

SERGEANT CHU:

25

He's a retired

Okay.

D-u-r-k.
D-u-r-k.
And you believe that

there was some information leak as far as the

85
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

communication with Lieutenant Durk?

2

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

That's what I think

3

brought this on, but, I -- I -- and I don't think

4

I'm an alarmist, I -- I think somehow somebody

5

was --

6
7

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

He was so upset, he

called IAB himself.

8

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

9

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

10

secret, then he got upset.

11

He was -- he was

but he was upset.

12

LARRY

13

SERGEANT CHU:

14

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

He's kind of old now,

SCHOOLCRAFT:

He's dying of cancer.

Okay.
Yeah, I believe that

15

it got leaked out.

Once they found out he was

16

involved and -- but I do believe somehow they were

17

monitoring, because I don't know whether they put a

18

listening device -- I'm not saying legal stuff, I'm

19

saying somehow something was monitored, because

20

there was a lot of stuff going on in the last -- the

21

last week, prior to this, that it's us talking, what

22

we were talking about, if they had heard that,

23

that's what brought this on.

24

saying something, somewhere -- I'm not up on current

25

technology and everything, so I have no idea, but I

So that's why I'm

86
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

believe they intercepted something, e-mails, cell

2

phone --

3

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Before I forget, when

4

they carried me out that last time, there were white

5

shirts and unidentified plainclothes still in my

6

apartment.

7

lieutenant was the one behind me --

And when -- the reason I know that that

8

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

9

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- or close behind

10

me, when they finally put it down, they loaded me in

11

the gurney, he would -- he did this and then he

12

walked up the stairs into my -- into the house and

13

up to my room, where they still were when they

14

carried me off in the ambulance.

15

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Now, I was wondering,

16

could you -- if there is any way you could find out,

17

by chance, did they voucher anything that they took?

18

SERGEANT CHU:

I -- I could do -- I could

19

-- I could look into seeing what was removed from

20

the apartment.

21
22
23
24
25

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Maybe Marino vouchered

the recorder.
SERGEANT CHU:

But you did see -- but your

last observation was that he had it in his hand -ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

In his right jacket

87
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

pocket.

2

SERGEANT CHU: -- transposed it from one

3

hand to another and put it into his right jacket

4

pocket?

5

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

6

SERGEANT CHU:

7

LARRY

Correct.

Okay.

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Now, sergeant, I have

8

been calling Marino and everything and asking where

9

his property was and nobody will return my call.

10

I've been asking what his status is, nobody will

11

return my call.

12

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

They give -- they

13

still have -- I believe they still have the keys.

14

Is there anyway -- since I can't do it, is there any

15

way someone can interview my landlord to see if

16

anyone has been in my apartment for --

17

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Of course, you have to

18

understand, his landlord is very good friends with

19

Delafuente, the lieutenant in (inaudible) --

20
21
22

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Who was my lieutenant

at the 81, who signed off on my failed evaluation.
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

And who lives next

23

door to when this happened and if he wasn't

24

working (inaudible) --

25

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Who hasn't talked to

88
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

me since I appealed it.

2

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Right.

So he's in on it.

He hasn't

3

talked to him.

And Teddy, his

4

landlord's in on it.

5

gonna get truthful -- he's a shady character

6

anyways, but, I mean, we didn't know that when you

7

moved in there, so...

So, you're not -- you're not

8

SERGEANT CHU:

All right.

9

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

But, any -- anyway,

10

so, a lot of stuff is going -- this all has been

11

documented.

12

all gonna have to come out.

13

gonna have to be listened to.

14

gonna -- (indiscernible) my stuff, because I don't

15

know what they took out of his apartment, but it's

16

not gonna do them any good because I've got it.

If

17

he's got one, I got two of everything he's got.

So,

18

you know, it didn't do them any good, it's just

19

gonna make them look worse, so...

20

-- it's gonna have to be -- I talked to Lieutenant

21

Cassel about this today, as a matter of fact and --

22

You could talk a year about it.

SERGEANT CHU:

It's

All the recordings are
And, again, it's all

But, it's gonna

You initially indicated

23

that you laid -- and I want to take your -- I want

24

to address your complaints as you perceive them to

25

be.

89
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
by --

3

SERGEANT CHU:

4

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

5

Attempted murder.
-- inspector -- Chief

Mauri -- Mau --

6

SERGEANT CHU:

7

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

8

SERGEANT CHU:

9

Of attempted murder

Marino.
-- Marino.

That he actually wanted to

see to your demise at that time?

10

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Correct.

He had EM

11

-- he was there when EMS advised me that my vitals

12

were such a condition I had to go to the hospital.

13

He knew that was gonna happen.

14

SERGEANT CHU:

15

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

16

Okay.
Or he was hoping that

it would happen.

17

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

All right.

Well,

18

I've taken in a lot of information, a lot of it, I

19

will confer with Sergeant Scott to make sure

20

whatever information he does not have, I'll furnish

21

it to him.

22

again, as -- but -- and I'm not -- I don't speak on

23

behalf of the department, I'm not trying to tell you

24

in any capacity as per NYPD or as per Sergeant Chu,

25

you do have to be guided with -- we have no input as

The only thing I can suggest to you,

90
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

to how the hospital wants to -- how they determine

2

to -- in your -- in their view of treating you,

3

okay.

4

know, you just be (inaudible) --

So, you know, I would just suggest that you

5
6

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
you did.

7
8
9
10

We never implied that

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

So, I just want

to -ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

It's obvious what's

-- what's going on has got to be investigated.

11

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

12

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

So -It could be something

13

as simple as -- I was thinking it was something more

14

-- I think it's something as simple as officers

15

lying on the report.

16

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

17

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay.
They -- they're

18

taking statements from officers and don't even know

19

their names.

20
21
22
23
24
25

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Did you tell him your

three-hour interview with Quality Assurance?
ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I told them I

reported this thing.
SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

interviewed by QAD, right?

So you already were

91
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Correct.

And then

2

seven days after that, I was placed on forced

3

monitoring.

4
5

SERGEANT CHU:

And when did -- when did

this occur?

6

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I didn't find out

7

about that until Sergeant -- I saw Sergeant Devino

8

regarding the appeal of my evaluation.

9

it to me.

She did a pepper check, she said.

10

SERGEANT CHU:

11

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

12

She showed

Yeah.
And she showed me the

14.

13

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

So he talked to

14

Quality Assurance for three hours and then right

15

after that they put him on performance monitoring.

16

Of course, they don't tell him.

17

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I mean, Sergeant

18

Scott called the 81 and left a message with the PBA

19

delegate, Richie Braun, yeah, tell Schoolcraft Scott

20

-- Sergeant Scott from IAB is trying to get ahold of

21

him.

Didn't even leave his phone number.

22

SERGEANT CHU:

All right.

23

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

And also Scott wanted

24

-- Scott was very interested in who -- who initiated

25

this.

Who was talking to IAB.

Okay.

So I don't

92
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

know what Scott has to do with this, but why did

2

Scott care who initiated the contact?

3

talking to Captain del Pozo?

4

it was David Durk.

5

this happens to Adrian?

6

talking.

Okay.

So I don't know who's

SERGEANT CHU:

8

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
school.

Adrian told him

And then, a week after that,

7

9

Who was

Okay.
Somebody talks out of

Somebody freaked and they overreacted.

10

SERGEANT CHU:

11

LARRY

Um-hmm.

SCHOOLCRAFT:

And -- but I believe

12

it's because, I told Adrian, it's not always what's

13

in the closet, it's the fact that you know

14

something's in the closet.

15

because you know this is in the closet, but you

16

don't know what else is in the closet.

17

SERGEANT CHU:

18

You don't always know --

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

19

SERGEANT CHU:

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Does anyone have
I probably -Oh, yeah.

I was --

ever since I became a witness --

24
25

Okay.

your contact information, sir?

22
23

And I think -- I just

think --

20
21

Yeah.

SERGEANT CHU:
mean?

-- I mean like from IAB, I

93
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
Everything.

3

SERGEANT CHU:

4

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

5

everything.

6
7

Sergeant Scott, are you -Everybody has

I mean everything.

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

I just wanted to

make sure before I --

8
9

Of course.

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Right.

Do you want --

I'll give it to you again, so you got it?

10

SERGEANT CHU:

11

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT: It's -- well, my name is

12

Oh sure.

Larry.

13

SERGEANT CHU:

14

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

15

I just want --

Um-hmm.
Same last name,

Schoolcraft.

16

SERGEANT CHU:

Yes.

17

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

18

SERGEANT CHU:

19

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

20

SERGEANT CHU:

21

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

22

SERGEANT CHU:

And it's (646) --

Um-hmm.
-- 957 --

Um-hmm.

2486.

-- 2486.
Okay.

All right.

23

So let me just -- I'm just going to speak to the

24

doctor, so that I have his name and the social

25

worker's name.

Is there anything else that you want

94
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

to address with them, while I'm here?

2
3

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Yeah.

I'd like to

talk to them while you're here.

4

SERGEANT CHU:

Okay.

5

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

I just need to -We're trying to

6

dispel this paranoia myth that they're creating to

7

keep me here.

8

SERGEANT CHU: Okay.

9

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

10

I mean, it's not, it

was still abduction --

11

SERGEANT CHU:

12

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT: -- even though he knows

13

Yeah.

I'm here now.

14

SERGEANT CHU:

15

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

16

Yeah.
-- but they intended

not to tell him, just like they intended to murder me.

17

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

18

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

He intended to kill

19

me that day, that's why they held me in that

20

position.

21

wasn't feeling well and they tried to kill me.

22

And then they assaulted me and then they abducted me.

23

They, at least, kidnapped me.

24
25

I told them my chest was hurting, I

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

They were hoping that

it would be an accident or something, something --

95
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
crazy.

Right.

Oh, he was

He was upset or some bullshit like that.

3

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

4

(Inaudible).

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

And that's exactly

5

how it's going to be presented to the Queens DA, or

6

the Brooklyn DA, where is this, however -- however

7

this goes.

8
9
10
11

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Queens DA, public

integrity, US Attorney's office, FBI, it's all -everybody's -ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Is there any question

12

to the attempted murder charge?

13

anything less than attempted murder?

14
15
16

SERGEANT CHU:

Did I explain

Well, I do -- that will not

be (inaudible)-ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

The EMS stated -- I

17

don't remember them saying my blood pressure, but

18

they said, He's gotta go to the hospital.

19

SERGEANT CHU:

Now, this was after --

20

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

And again, they were

21

talking to them.

22

And I said, why are you talking to them about my

23

medical condition?

24
25

The EMS guy was talking to them.

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
hearing that.

Right.

I remember

96
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

And he just, he just

2

did this, like, um-hmm, you know, just looked at me

3

like --

4
5

SERGEANT CHU:

clarify, when he said your vitals looked tachy --

6
7

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT: He said -- that was the
word he used.

8
9

SERGEANT CHU:

-- that was after you were

stepped on by Chief Marino?

10
11

Well, when they -- just to

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
before.

12

SERGEANT CHU:

13

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

14

This is before.
This was when I went

out with them --

15

SERGEANT CHU:

16

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

17

No, no, it was

Yeah.
-- reluctantly, I

objected.

18

SERGEANT CHU:

Yeah.

19

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

But they said that I

20

was disobeying a lawful -- I don't know, I just woke

21

up, I just had a shot of NyQuil, I just woke up.

22

Okay.

23

I better go with them.
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Sergeant, what I don't

24

understand, I believe they suspended him and took

25

his ID card, so if --

97
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

2

Where's his ID?

3

ID.

4

his face.

The Lieutenant said,

I take out my wallet, I give him my

He looks at me like -- and like with shock on
And my answer was like, go now.

5

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

6

right, they told him he was suspended.

7

suspended, why does he have to go anywhere with

8

them?

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

And where was my

delegate?

11

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

12

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

13

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

14

So if he's

First of all --

9
10

They told him --

Yeah.
And where was -Yeah, where has his

delegate been?

15

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- (indiscernible) or

16

somebody else, they're coming to an EDP police

17

officer?

18

hands are up and there's no weapon, where was the

19

delegate behind them?

I understand ESU coming in, but once my

(Indiscernible) --

20

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

21

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

22
23
24
25

Sergeant --- a doctor?

Somebody?
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Right.

Doesn't there

have to be some prerequisite -ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Look's like

98
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

Councilman Vann's gonna have fun with this one --

2

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

3
4

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT: -- unless he doesn't
like police officers.

5
6

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
paperwork before?

7
8

-- prerequisite

What -- what was the paper --

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Who gave the authorization

for this --

9

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT: Yeah.

10
11

-- prerequisite --

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- that's what I wanna

LARRY

But where's the

know?

12

SCHOOLCRAFT:

13

paperwork for the EDP?

14

know, this is all after the fact, trying to cover it

15

up, what did they do initially?

16

Where is -- where -- you

It sounded to me -- and when you guys hear

17

the recording -- it's like they're making it up as

18

they go.

19

him out of that apartment.

20

Their key, their whole purpose is to get

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Do you have everything

21

you need to start the investigation?

22

thing need to be waited until I'm out?

23

SERGEANT CHU:

24

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

25

Or does this

No, I'll make sure -I got -- I got a

funny feeling from Scott yesterday.

99
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

SERGEANT CHU:

2

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

3

Like, call me when you

get out.

4
5

Well, what --

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
lieutenant that.

I told -- I told the

Call me when you get out?

6

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

7

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

8

Is this gonna -That's why they sent

you.

9

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Have I came anything

10

short that would start a criminal investigation on

11

this?

12

SERGEANT CHU:

Oh, no.

We are starting an

13

investigation, whether it's determined to be

14

criminal or not it's determined by the district

15

attorney's office.

16

type of allegation of criminality against any police

17

officer, we do a conferral with the DA's office and

18

they make a determination if there is any

19

criminality or not.

20

type of murder or attempted murder case, there has

21

to be certain elements that have to be proven before

22

that charge can be brought forth, so --

23

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

24
25

And that would be case of any

You know, as you know, in any

I have the ACR number.

Do you want that before you go?
SERGEANT CHU:

I can obtain that through

100
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

the -- through the DA department.

2
3

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
male.

4

SERGEANT CHU:

5

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

6

SERGEANT CHU:

7

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

8

SERGEANT CHU:

10

12

Yeah.
The male was driving.

Yeah.
And the male took my

blood pressure.

9

11

It was a female and a

Okay.

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

But he didn't do

anything.
SERGEANT CHU:

So, I want to make sure I

13

am receiving your complaints, your allegations, as

14

it pertains to each of the officers.

15

know -- and I'm being honest with you -- cannot sit

16

here and make that determination whether all those,

17

the complaints that you have are actually the

18

allegations that are going to be specifically

19

addressed, because they may be -- what you indicate

20

as murder might just may be unnecessary force.

21

know what I mean?

22

criminality and the DA's have to make that -- they

23

make the determination whether they -- it was

24

believed to be criminality.

25

I cannot, you

You

Because you're talking about

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

We understand that.

101
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

Aggravated kidnapping and --

2

SERGEANT CHU:

But, you know, I do --

3

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

4

SERGEANT CHU:

-- civil rights --

-- what you believe, what

5

you perceive of the actions that were -- that

6

occurred against you, that have been taken against

7

you, I do that at this intake stage and that will be

8

addressed as part and parcel of what you're

9

complaining, what you're alleging of.

So, you know,

10

am I -- am I going to say -- sit here and say that

11

Chief Marino is alleged of attempted murder --

12

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

13

SERGEANT CHU: -- whether that's going to

14
15
16

be substantiated -ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT: -- is an investigation
and not for (inaudible) --

17

SERGEANT CHU:

18

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

19
20
21
22
23
24
25

All I ask for -

Yes.
An objective

investigation.
SERGEANT CHU:

Yes.

And that's what will

-- what will happen.
ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Right.

That's all I

ask, objective and (inaudible) -LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
investigated (indiscernible).

It's going to be

102
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

SERGEANT CHU:

I mean, we, you know --

2

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

3

SERGEANT CHU:

(Indiscernible).

-- in Group 1, don't -- you

4

know, we don't have any -- we don't -- we don't,

5

necessarily, you know, have any feelings, one way or

6

other, as it pertains to the executives.

7

a job that we do.

8

you know, sometimes are involved in certain levels

9

of misconduct and, you know, things are what they

10
11

are, you know.

It's just

The executives are all as well,

And, you know --

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Sergeant, does, I --

12

just, I'm curious, I mean, you're talking like a say

13

a two star chief or a three star chief, I mean, or

14

say the same allegation, or, I mean, say it was,

15

it's fact, they're gonna go after him just as hard

16

as if it was a patrolman?

17

SERGEANT CHU:

Absolutely.

Because the

18

department, the commissioner and the department, as

19

a whole, do not want to -- certainly do not want to

20

be embarrassed by any type of misconduct by anybody

21

of any higher rank, and especially if --

22

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

23

SERGEANT CHU:

Yes.

(Inaudible).
But this actually a

24

much more significant light on the department as a

25

whole, and so certainly if there has been misconduct

103
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

proven then the -- in my experience, and again I don't

2

have any day-to-day communication --

3
4

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

SERGEANT CHU:

-- but, in the things that

I see, the penalty is really no different.

7

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

8

SERGEANT CHU:

9
10

I understand.

The scary thing --

5
6

No.

Okay.

The rank and file, myself

included, don't hear about it, but the penalty phase
is no different.

Excuse me.

11
12

(Phone ringing)

13
14
15

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
evaluated with my attorney.

16
17

DR. ISAKOV:

Okay.

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

19

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

20

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

22
23
24
25

Then -- and then we

will wait until the attorney is here.

18

21

I want to be

Okay.
Okay.

(Inaudible).

Dad, go with the

sergeant.
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

No.

I got some things

I have to have answered before I leave here.
In the next five minutes, sergeant, I'll
walk out with you, is that okay?

104
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

2

SERGEANT CHU:

3

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

4

Thanks.

Okay.
Sorry, but this is --

I've been -- I've been locked up for four days --

5

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

I need -- Christine is

6

the social worker and I need Christine to come back

7

to answer some questions.

8
9

DR. ISAKOV:

What social worker questions

do you have?

10

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

I wanna know, for one,

11

who is the mental health legal service lawyer?

12

Adrian wants to file a --

13

DR. ISAKOV:

14

And,

can give you the number to call.

15

LARRY

I can give you the name and I

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay.

He wants to

16

file -- where can he get a written request for

17

release?

18

Nobody's --

He needs the form.

19

DR. ISAKOV:

20

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

21

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

22

DR. ISAKOV:

23

To release what?
Me.
His person.

I told you, it's a doctor,

it's not the social worker's decision for release.

24
25

He needs to file.

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
leave?

I don't request to

105
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Well, you see, Adrian

is going to request, he wants to --

3

DR. ISAKOV:

Okay.

You can get the -- get

4

the 72 hour (inaudible), and I want to get a written

5

document, I don't feel that I have any mental reason

6

to be here.

7
8

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

DR. ISAKOV:

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

DR. ISAKOV:
regular paper.

15
16

And by the law, we

Okay.

Well, you've

had, okay -- so where do we get that form?

13
14

Okay.

need -- we have 72 hours to respond to it.

11
12

That's what

I'm asking for.

9
10

Yes, sir.

It's not a form, it's just

You can get put piece of paper --

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT: Okay.

And he what, he

writes it out?

17

DR. ISAKOV:

He will write out --

18

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

19

DR. ISAKOV: -- that I am so and so, in the

Have to write it out.

20

hospital, I wanted to be released in the hospital

21

because I don't have any mental illness.

22

it and --

23
24
25

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

He'll sign

(Inaudible) write it

out.
DR. ISAKOV:

-- he will hand it to me, I

106
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

will put the date and time when he handed it to me.

2

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay.

And then how

3

does he scheduled to go before a hearing, to get a

4

hearing before a judge?

5

DR. ISAKOV:

A hearing now, today is,

6

what, Wednesday, yes?

7

will be here, his mental health lawyer --

Tomorrow morning the lawyer

8

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

9

DR. ISAKOV:

It's not my lawyer.

-- for the patient.

10

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

11

DR. ISAKOV:

Okay.

It's not your lawyer that

12

maybe you want, but this is a lawyer that state

13

providing to every patient who getting admitted to

14

our hospital.

15

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

So, he's automatically

16

provided a mental health lawyer?

17

DR. ISAKOV:

18

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

19

Yes, yes, right.
And he will see that

lawyer tomorrow?

20

DR. ISAKOV:

Tomorrow morning.

21

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

22

DR. ISAKOV:

Okay.

Tomorrow morning he will

23

discuss with him and will tell him the same that I

24

want to be discharged, I don't feel that I need to

25

be here.

107
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

2

DR. ISAKOV:

Right.

And, if you, by tomorrow, for

3

example, or day after tomorrow, depending how long

4

it will take to finish our evaluation, if we do not

5

come to a conclusion that we need to discharge him,

6

then he has the right to take us to the court and

7

the court usually happens on Tuesdays.

8

day he can be in the court it will be Tuesday, if we

9

do not release him before then.

10
11

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Do we have to wait

the 72 hours to go to court?

12
13

The first

DR. ISAKOV:

The 72 hours is for us to

respond.

14

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

15

have to wait for that to go to a judge?

16
17
18
19
20
21

DR. ISAKOV:

Right.

But do we

I told you, the judge usually

sit at our hospital only Tuesday.
LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Excuse me.

I know

what you're saying, that you don't (inaudible).
ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

How about clothes?

Can I wear clothes?

22

DR. ISAKOV:

Yeah, sure.

23

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Oh, okay.

24

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

(Inaudible).

25

DR. ISAKOV:

Do you have your clothes with

108
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

you?

2
3

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
think, or (inaudible).

4
5

They have a bag, I

DR. ISAKOV:

If they need to be washed, we

can wash them (indiscernible).

6

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay.

7

is there an actual commitment order?

8

I just have --

you actually going by?

9
10

Or what are

Is there an actual commitment order that
is keeping him --

11

DR. ISAKOV:

I will -- I will explain you.

12

The reason that he was brought here is pretty

13

serious business and you can understand that a lot

14

of things was going in his life lately that he

15

wasn't happy with.

16
17

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Yeah.

That's what we

would like to know, because we don't know about it.

18

DR. ISAKOV:

Okay.

When he came to the

19

hospital and the psychiatrist was called to evaluate

20

him, when they evaluated him, he presented with this

21

suspiciousness for the -- with the -- with the plot

22

that some crime going on in the police department.

23

I don't --

24
25

LARRY
sarge?

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Are you getting this,

109
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

SERGEANT CHU:

(Indiscernible) listening.

2

DR. ISAKOV:

3

true or if it's of his beliefs.

-- I don't know now if it's

4

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

5

DR. ISAKOV:

6

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

7

DR. ISAKOV:

8

I don't know.

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

12

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

I don't know.

DR. ISAKOV:

For me --

-- Doc, what you're

figure out if it's true -LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

17

DR. ISAKOV:

So --

-- or it's just his own

belief --

19

21

So what

For me, now, my job is to

16

20

I understand.

saying is --

14

18

Doctor --

you're saying -DR. ISAKOV:

15

I -- I --

-- don't -- I'm not working

11

13

Well --

there.

9
10

You understand?

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay.

I understand

that.
DR. ISAKOV:

-- now I will tell you a

22

little bit more.

But because I get the information

23

that one year ago he was evaluated by a psychiatrist

24

in his office and the decision was made that his gun

25

need to be taken away from him, then I need to have

110
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

the access to this evaluation to see what's

2

happening (inaudible) --

3
4

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
trying to get for a year.

5
6

DR. ISAKOV:

-- what is the -- what is

the --

7

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

8

DR. ISAKOV:

9

That's what I've been

Reason.

-- reason.

result of the evaluation?

And what was the

He was recommended

10

treatment, he was diagnosed with some mental illness

11

or not.

12
13
14

When I will get -LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

I hope you have

better luck than we did.
DR. ISAKOV:

-- when I will get this all

15

information, and according to my observation talking

16

to him and discussing stuff, and if everything will

17

come out that there is nothing dangerous for himself

18

or to others and if he needs some treatment, we will

19

recommend some treatment, or if not, then we will

20

tell, okay, nothing to be done, then I will be

21

comfortable to tell him now you go.

22

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

But, Doctor, what

23

happens if the police department doesn't give you

24

the paperwork you need, so, he could be here

25

indefinitely until the police department --

111
TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1

DR. ISAKOV:

Again, I -- they need to give

2

me the reason why they brought him here.

3

don't tell me, no, it's court information, that

4

nobody can get it, only up under a court order, it's

5

different story, then I will tell (indiscernible).

6

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

7

DR. ISAKOV:

8
9
10
11

If they

Okay.

I cannot -- I need to base my

decision by my evaluation.
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Right.

Okay.

I

appreciate that.
DR. ISAKOV:

If they tell me that now, if

12

you will sign a release information, we will send it

13

to you, you will sign a release information and they

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will fax it to us.

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LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
already been done?
DR. ISAKOV:

He just came.

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
sometime before this.

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department taken these steps?

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25

I told you, I

saw him first time today.

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Why hasn't that

DR. ISAKOV:
wrong person.

Yeah, but, I mean,

Why hasn't the police
I mean --

Once again, you're asking the

You need to ask them that.

LARRY
(indiscernible).

SCHOOLCRAFT:

It seems I'm always

But, doctor, what you're basing

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the fact that his being here is, is you're saying

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some doctor --

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DR. ISAKOV:

Okay.

What I'm saying, that I

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don't see that he's acting this out, I don't see him

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-- he's agitated or he need to be medicated --

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LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

7

DR. ISAKOV:

Hey, doctor --

-- or suggest that he be on

8

medication.

I don't see it.

But the only thing

9

that I see that he still has this idea that is

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something wrong going on in the police, and I need

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to investigate, how much is it going on?

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13

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
getting this?

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15

Sergeant, are you

SERGEANT CHU:

No, I am.

I -- I understand

what the doctor is saying.

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LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Do you find it very

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interesting?

He's being held here because of his

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allegations, not because there is anything wrong

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with him.

I mean, you are grasping that, right?

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ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

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DR. ISAKOV:

This is retaliation.

Again, I -- I don't know,

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again, if I'm doing something wrong, I'm doing it in

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his --

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25

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

We're not -- you

understand because (inaudible) --

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2

DR. ISAKOV:

-- if I don't get, there's

nothing wrong with him, it will be in your benefit.

3

SERGEANT CHU:

You have to understand from

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the doctor's perspective that he does not know

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Adrian up until a couple of days, so --

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7

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

So he's

trying to verify if it's legitimate.

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SERGEANT CHU:

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LARRY

Yeah.

SCHOOLCRAFT:

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SERGEANT CHU:

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LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

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Right.

Well, he -Not if it's --

Yes.
-- legitimate, but if

Adrian believes it's legitimate.

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SERGEANT CHU:

14

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

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that.

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Yes.

Right.

I understand

with you --

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I understand that.

Yes.

DR. ISAKOV:

I -- and I sympathize

Then, again, even if it's

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legitimate, I wanted to know what he want to do with

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this?

20

authorities and they need to take care of it, is one

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story.

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myself, I will go and punish them, is a different

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story.

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25

If he will say, I just will report it to the

If he will tell, no, I need to take care of

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Yeah.

why the Internal Affairs is here.

Well, that's
Adrian has been

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reporting it.

2

DR. ISAKOV:

3

he's a (inaudible) --

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5

LARRY

DR. ISAKOV:

Right.

That's why

-- that's why I need to see if

he's dangerous, if he wanted to do something.

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9

SCHOOLCRAFT:

That's why

it's important --

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7

You understand?

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
doctor.

10

Right.

I understand,

That's why we wanted -DR. ISAKOV:

Especially if the gun was

11

taken away, probably was some suspicion that he can

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do something.

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LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

That's why we wanted

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the sergeant here, so he can see that Adrian is not

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dreaming this up, and he's willing to talk to you,

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but...

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Okay, but you can understand, if there

18

must be what, how many thousands of reports out

19

there everyday where a citizen says, I believe this

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happened, this happened and this happened and police

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make reports.

22

in a mental hospital to see if you are mentally

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stable enough to make this report.

They don't say, we've gotta put you

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I mean, am I right, Sergeant?

I mean,

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that's what they are basing his incarceration on,

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the fact that he's making allegations and -- so now

2

we gotta lock him up to see if he is mentally able

3

to make those allegations.

4

IAB, he's gotta be mentally, psychologically

5

cleared.

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7

SERGEANT CHU:
you are perceiving that.

So before he reports to

No.

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

9

SERGEANT CHU:

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ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

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LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

-- you know --

SERGEANT CHU:

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LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

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ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Absolutely.
And they do.
And they do in

Bedford-Stuyvesant, standing on the corner --

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LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

You don't have a

chance, you don't have a chance.

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22

If they can do it to

him, they can do it to anybody.

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20

It's how the public's

going to perceive it, that's the problem.
SERGEANT CHU:

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Oh, I'm perceiving it.

And as far as the --

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14

I understand how

I totally do.

8

10

No.

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:
on the corner.

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Go with him.

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

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Okay.

25

tomorrow?

-- (inaudible) stand

I'm going with him.

Doctor, so what time is the lawyer coming

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DR. ISAKOV:

He's in in the morning.

2

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

3

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay.

Now --

Do I have to sign --

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sign in, somewhere, and let them know that I'm

5

requesting him?

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7

DR. ISAKOV:

No, that it's definitely he

will see you.

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9

Or just be up --

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
patients?

10

DR. ISAKOV:

11

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

12

They see all the

They see every new patient.
Oh, okay.

Okay.

good, good.

13

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay.

Good.

Those

14

questions you've answered, I appreciate it, Doctor.

15

And...

16

lately...

And I'm having really bad brain farts

17

Sergeant, do you have any questions?

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SERGEANT CHU:

19

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

20

No.
You're

ready to go?

21

SERGEANT CHU:

22

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

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You're cleared.

Thanks.
Okay, so -- yeah, I

got that, I'll make copies, I'm making copies.

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ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Make copies of this.

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LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

So, now, are you gonna

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TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
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-- are you gonna talk to him now, doctor?

2

DR. ISAKOV:

(Inaudible).

3

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

Okay.

And, so, how

4

long do you think you will need to evaluate him, or

5

is that based on what you hear?

6

DR. ISAKOV:

7

The evaluation is

ongoing (inaudible) --

8
9

Yeah.

I mean --

SERGEANT CHU:

And, again, in a -- in all

fairness to the doctor, the doctor will probably --

10

you know, it's -- it's hard to give any type of

11

direct questions, like, you know, if I go and see my

12

family doctor about something --

13

LARRY

14

SERGEANT CHU:

15

LARRY

16

SCHOOLCRAFT:

It's subjective.

Yeah, it's very subjective.

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Yes.

I understand

that.

17

SERGEANT CHU:

In all honesty, sir, I

18

think it's -- quite honestly, it's an unfair

19

question to ask of him right now.

20

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

21

you're saying.

22

asking.

I know what

That's not -- that's not what I'm

What I'm asking is, if he is okay --

23

SERGEANT CHU:

24

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

25

No.

take to evaluate him?

Yeah.
-- how long will it

If there isn't any problems,

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TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
1
2

how long will it take?
DR. ISAKOV:

That's what I'm asking.
It's again, the evaluation,

3

as I told you, is not just one part just talking

4

with him, talking with him is one part.

5

part will be obtaining information --

6
7
8
9
10
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12
13
14

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

The other

Yeah, but the point is

to that, doctor -DR. ISAKOV:

-- from the previous

evaluation and -LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT: -- what happens if you
can't get any of that information?
DR. ISAKOV:

If not, then I will just base

on my own evaluation and do what I'm going to do.
LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:

That's what I'm --

15

again, doctor, that's what I am asking you.

How

16

long is it gonna take you to evaluate him?

Forget

17

about everybody else, you, a psychiatrist?

18

If everything is okay with him, and there

19

isn't a problem, how long will it take for you to

20

say, there's not a problem?

21

DR. ISAKOV:

I tell you, again, it will

22

not take long, but the only thing that's holding him

23

now to tell me what is the result of the evaluation,

24

that we don't have any information that we would

25

like to have.

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TAPE-RECORDED INTERVIEW
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2

LARRY

SCHOOLCRAFT:

Again, you might

never get that information.

3

DR. ISAKOV:

Again, it's -- I will call

4

them tomorrow and I will contact somebody and he

5

will sign the release form --

6

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

7

her number, directly.

8

DR. ISAKOV:

9

ADRIAN SCHOOLCRAFT:

Give her -- give him

10

-- (inaudible).
-- give him

Lamstein's number.

11

DR. ISAKOV:

Then I -- then if they will

12

say, no, this information will not be available to

13

you, then we will tell, okay, we will make own

14

decision.

15
16

LARRY SCHOOLCRAFT:
tomorrow.

Okay.

Don't worry about it.

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(End of recording)

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* * *

I'll take care

Okay.

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CERTIFICATION

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4

I, DEBRA S. NIEVES, certify that the foregoing

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transcript was prepared from a digital audio

6

recording and is a true and accurate record of the

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same.

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____________________________

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AMERICAN LEGAL TRANSCRIPTION

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11 Market Street, Suite 215

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Poughkeepsie, New York 12601

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Date:

March 2, 2015

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-o0o-