I/P Engine, Inc. v. AOL, Inc. et al

Filing 512

Declaration re 511 Opposition, of Howard Chen in Support of Defendants' Opposition to Plaintiff's Daubert Motion, and Fourth Motion in Limine to Exclude Lyle Ungar's New Theory of Invalidity and Opinions Regarding Claim Construction by AOL Inc., Gannett Company, Inc., Google Inc., IAC Search & Media, Inc., Target Corporation. (Attachments: # 1 Exhibit 1, # 2 Exhibit 2, # 3 Exhibit 3, # 4 Exhibit 4, # 5 Exhibit 5, # 6 Exhibit 6, # 7 Exhibit 7, # 8 Exhibit 8, # 9 Exhibit 9, # 10 Exhibit 10, # 11 Exhibit 11, # 12 Exhibit 12, # 13 Exhibit 13)(Noona, Stephen)

EXHIBIT 13

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UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

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EASTERN DISTRICT OF VIRGINIA

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NORFOLK DIVISION

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------------------------x

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I/P ENGINE, INC.,
Plaintiff,

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v.

:
: Civil Action No.
: 2:11-cv-512

AOL, INC., et al.,
Defendants.

:
:

------------------------x

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CONFIDENTIAL - OUTSIDE ATTORNEYS' EYES ONLY

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Videotaped Deposition of LYLE UNGAR, Ph.D.

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Philadelphia, Pennsylvania

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Saturday, September 22, 2012

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1:03 p.m.

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Job No.: 26365

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Pages: 1 - 266

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Reported by: Debra A. Whitehead

CONFIDENTIAL VIDEOTAPED DEPOSITION OF LYLE UNGAR, Ph.D.

CONDUCTED ON SATURDAY, SEPTEMBER 22, 2012
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simple version that we've described, I didn't say

18:34:40

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anything about looking for an item.

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said you walk through it, you collect all the stuff.

Right?

I just

Now, obviously, if you're looking for

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18:34:45
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something, a good way to look for it is to spider

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through.

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web pages, you would still need to look for it.

But once you spidered and collected all the

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Q

Where would you look for it?

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A

Typically you collected these web pages --

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say I'm looking for web pages that have the word

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"Paris."

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whole bunch of web pages, say a billion.

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found Paris yet.

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spidered and collected the web pages, I need to now go

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through and say, Okay, which of these pages have Paris

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on it?

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I might first spider the web, collect a
I haven't

I now need to actually, having

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Q

Where does that happen?

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A

Where does that happen when?

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18:35:18

18:35:30
In some

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spidering systems they keep looking at each page as

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they pull it, does it have Paris on it, and follow

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links most likely to have Paris on them.

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In other systems, more commonly, the

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18:35:44

CONFIDENTIAL VIDEOTAPED DEPOSITION OF LYLE UNGAR, Ph.D.

CONDUCTED ON SATURDAY, SEPTEMBER 22, 2012
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simpler spidering ones spider everything first, take

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all the results of the spidering, put them into

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something which I'll call a database, using it in a

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general term.

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we've got all these -- these pages, let's process

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them, clean them up, and now let's look for Paris

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inside these pages.

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So note that the looking for and

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And then once there they say, Ah, okay

examining --

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Q

Okay.

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A

-- is a little bit different from the

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spidering.

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Q

Okay.

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A

So the piece you said is looking for or

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examining items.

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You've got to actually find the pages, but then you

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have to examine them or look for them.

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Q

Okay.

And I really want two things.

So that first thing that you do,

finding the pages, is that what you said?

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A

Yes.

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Q

Finding the pages.

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18:36:20

18:36:28
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Is that satisfied, in

your view, by spidering?

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18:36:38
18:36:44

CONFIDENTIAL VIDEOTAPED DEPOSITION OF LYLE UNGAR, Ph.D.

CONDUCTED ON SATURDAY, SEPTEMBER 22, 2012
231
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A

Yes.

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Q

Okay.

18:36:47
Is that the only way in which you

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could find the pages, according to the court's

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construction of scanning a network, or is that --

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A

So --

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Q

I'm sorry.

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A

Sorry.

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network.

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Go ahead.

Looking for or examining items in a

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So your question -- I haven't thought it

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through carefully -- is could there be some other way

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that doesn't use anything -- doesn't use any spidering

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that still looks for or examines items in a network.

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Q

Correct.

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A

It's not obvious to me off the top of my

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head how to do that.

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there would be.

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definition that says spidering has to be the way to do

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it.

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of how I would do it.

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But I'm -- I could imagine that

There's nothing intrinsic to the

That's somehow the obvious way that comes to mind

I would need to take -- I would need to

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think much more carefully about an alternate

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implementation of that.

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CONFIDENTIAL VIDEOTAPED DEPOSITION OF LYLE UNGAR, Ph.D.

CONDUCTED ON SATURDAY, SEPTEMBER 22, 2012
232
Q

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You haven't formed any opinions as to

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whether there's an alternate implementation of

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scanning a network that would not require a spider?

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A

I have not.

I didn't feel any need to.

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Q

You didn't form -- you didn't consider

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forming such an opinion in connection with your

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noninfringement report?

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Did I consider forming such?

I'm sorry,

I'm trying to distinguish two questions.

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Did I form such an opinion, no.

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Q

Let me ask it --

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A

Did I consider it and then reject it, the

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idea of forming it?

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again.

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I'm sorry.

Try your question

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Q

So it's true that you did not form an

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opinion, when performing your noninfringement

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analysis, as to whether there's an alternate

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implementation of scanning a network that would not

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require a spider.

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A

That's correct.

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Q

Are there -- is it possible to use a spider

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in an office LAN?

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18:39:02