Motion Picture Association of America v. CrystalTech Web Hosting Inc.

Filing 1294

Motion Picture Association of America v. CrystalTech Web Hosting Inc.

Doc. 1294 Att. 5

,"'~ ."\

IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

FOR THE DISTRICT OF ARIZONA
PRESCOTT DIVISION

UNITED STATES OF AMRICA,

) )
) )

Plaintiff,
v.
ELIZABETH A. GARDNER and FREDRIC A. GARDNER, each individually and

LJ COpy

) Case No.

) CVOS-3073-PCT-EHC
)

d/b/a BETHEL AR MINISTRIES,

)
) ) ) )

Defendants.

:'1-

DEPOSITION OF 2REDRIC A. GARDNER Prescott, Arizona May 31, 2007
11:40 a.m.

REPORTED BY:

Eve K. Burton, RPR, eRR Certified Reporter No. 50261
,f' ~:

is PLANnFF

I '( l EXIBI

LOTT REPORTING, INC.
316 North Alarcon Street Prescott, AZ 86301

928.776.1169
099
Dockets.Justia.com

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2 3
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INDEX
FREDRI CA. GARDNER
Examina tion by Mr. Shoemaker
PAGE
4

5
6

7
8

9

EXHIBITS
NO.

10

DESCRIPTION
(None marked)

PAGE

II
l2
13
14

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16
17
18

19 20

2l
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LOTT REPORTING, INC./928.776.1169

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1 THE DEPOSITION OF FREDRIC A. GARDNER, taken
2 on May 31, 2007, commencing at 11: 40 a.m., at the offices

3 of Lott Reporting, Inc., located at 316 North Alarcon
4 Street, Prescott, Arizona, before Eve K. Burton,

5 Registered Professional Reporter, Certified Reporter
6 No. 50261, in the State of Arizona.
7

8 APPEARANCES:
9

10 11 12 13 14

u. S. DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE

By: Martin M. Shoemaker, Esq.

Tax Division

P.O. Box 7238 Washington, D. C. 20044

is
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17 18

Mrs. Elizabeth A. Gardner, In Propria Persona P.O. Box 2038 Dewey, Arizona 86327

Mr. Fredric A. Gardner, In Propria Persona P.O. Box 2038 Dewey, Arizona 86327

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20 21 22

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24

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LOTT REPORTING, INC./928.776.1169

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1 FREDRIC A. GARDNER,
2 a witness herein, having been first duly sworn by the
3 Certified Court Reporter to speak the truth and nothing i 4 but the truth, was examined and testified as follows:
5

6 EXAINATION
8

7 BY MR. SHOEMAKER:

Q.

All right. Mr. Gardner, could you give your full

9 name, please.

10

A. Q. A.
Q.

Fredric

that's F-r-e-d-r-i-c -- A. Gardner.

11 12

Could ~ou tell me your residential address.
570 Apache Knolls Trail, Dewey, Arizona 86327.

13
14
15

Do you have a different mailing address?

MRS. GARDNER: Yes, you do.

THE WITNESS: Oh, yeah. P.O. Box 2038,

16 Dewey, Arizona.
1 7 BY MR. SHOEMAER:

18 Q. Is your phone number also --

19 A. Pardon me?
20 Q. Is your phone number also 928-775-5454?

21 A. Yes.
22 Q. And is your cell phone number the same as your
23 wife's? Do you have a separate cell phone number?

24 A. I do, yeah, but I don't know it.
25

MRS. GARDNER: 602-692-2335.
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1 2
3
4

THE WITNESS: I never call me.

BY MR. SHOEMAR:
Q. All right. Mr. Gardner, you sat in on the
deposition of your wife this morning; is that correct?

5

A. Yes.
Q. And, in fact, you had at least a minor speaking
role in that deposition; is that right?

6
7

8
9

A. Minor.
Q. SO you know what a deposition is?

10 11 12
13

A. Yes, sir.
Q. Prior to coming here today, have you had your
deposition taken before?

A. Yes. In the same case where we sued a radio
station, yes.

14

~

15

Q. All right. Could you tell me your post-high
school education?

16
17

A. I attended Kent State University. I've also
attended ABI educational courses for banking. I have
attended Christ For the Nations Institute, 1976 and' 77.

18 19

20 21
22

I also have education in accounting from the Paralegal

Institute of Phoenix~ I also have estate and financial
planning degrees from the Career Institute of Atlanta,

23
24

Georgia. And that's about it.
Q. What year did you get your degree at Kent State?

25

A. I didn't finish at Kent State. The war in -- no.

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if
1 2

Kent State, I didn't finish my final year.

Q. All right. What was your final year?

3
4

A. My final year was 19- -- let's see -- '68.
Q. Did you have a major?

5
6 7
8

A. Business.

Q. Did you take tax classes as part of that -A. Accounting classes, mostly.

Q. All right. Was there any tax classes, specific
tax classes, at Kent State, that you took?

9

10

A. Boy, that's a long time ago. I can't remember.
Yes, I did, as a matter of fact. It was around

11 12 13 14

corporations.

Q. You're a certified estate planner; iS that
correct?

15
16 17
1S

A. Yes, sir.
Q. Is that a formal licensed position?

A. No. It's -- it depends on the state that you
live in. State of Arizona does require you to pass an
examination, but it's a certificate from the institute
that I attended.

19 20
21

Q. Where did you learn about corporation soles? A. Learned about corporation sole with assisting my
wife in research.

22

23
24

Q. And where did you learn about LLCs or trusts?
A. I learned about LLCs through my courses with'

25

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V
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Co

accounting and in estate planning and financial planning

2
3 4 5

schooling. Similar with trusts.
Q. All right. Can you give me your employment
history since leaving Kent State?

A. Oh, since leaving Kent State, I worked -- for
SiX years, I was in the banking industry.

6
7
8

Q. In what capacity?
A. Loan officer. And

after that, we attended Bible

9

college. And then from there, we came to Phoenix, and we
established our corporation, Maranatha Enterprises.

10

11
12 13
14

Q. That's the bookstore?
A. That's the bookstore. And in 1993, we sold that
to another entity. And we went full-time into ministry.

Q. Are you an ordained minister?

15

A. Yes, sir.
Q. And when did you receive your ordination?

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17

A. 1978.
Q. When did your wife become an ordained minister?

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19 20 21

A. 1978.
Q. When were you married?

A. 1973.

22

Q. You're a pastor of Bethel Aram Ministries; is
that correct?

23
24

A. Yes.

25

Q. You're one of the three elders on the board of
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1 elders of Bethel Aram Ministries; is that correct?
2
3

A.
Q.

Yes. Yes.
What does David Bordon do for Bethel Aram

4 Ministries?
5 6
7
~

A.

He helps us when we're

MRS. GARDNER: He serves as an elder.
*

THE WITNESS: He serves as an elder, and he

8 also helps us when we're not at home. See, we travel and
9 minister, so he stays at home and takes care of the

10 congregation at home.

11 12

MRS. GARDNER: And answers phones.
THE WITNESS: And answers the phone for us.

13 BY MR. SHOEMAER:
14
Q.
Now, what do you -- other than being the

15 pastor -- well, as a pastor, what do you do?

16

A.

I do music ministry. I also do some counseling

1 7 of people who have problems. I help Elizabeth with the
18 preparation of each service that we have on Sundays and

19 Thursdays. We also

I also help -- when we travel, I

20 assist her in ministry there also.
21
Q.
What's your role in the corporation

22 sole/trust/LLC aspect of Bethel Aram Ministries?

23

A.

My role is I try to educate people in the proper

24 use of LLCs and trusts. And as far as corporation sale
25 goes, mainly my wife handles that portion of it. .

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1

Q.

All right. When did you first learn of the

2 corporation sole structure or form?
3

A.

/

The way it's supposed to be used was 1997 in our

4 research.
5

MRS. GARDNER: Early' 90s.

'95, '96, when

6 we did the research.
7

THE WITNESS: We started our research in

8 ' 95, but we've compiled it all and established the way

9 that the corporation should be used, and it all came

10 together in 1997. 11 BY MR. SHOEMAKER:

12

Q.

Now, you heard me ask Elizabeth about the

13 paperwork involved or the process of getting a corporation
14 sole set up by Bethel Aram Ministries. Off the top of

15 your head, can you add anything to that? Can you recall
16 if she left anything out or anything like that?

17
18

A.
Q.

Not that I can recall, no.

Do you meet with persons who want to set up a

19 corporation sole?
20

A.
Q.

I would be in a room with them, yes.
All right. . Would you speak with them by

21

22 telephone also?

-

23
24

A.
Q.

Most the time, I turn it over to my wife.

All right. If they weren't -- if your wife

25 wasn't present, would you be handling -,

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1

A.
Q.
..

Yes.
-- do ing that part?

2 3 .v4

A.
Q.

Yes.
What do you do for the Web site, corpsole.org?

5
6
7 8

A.
Q.

Nothing.
Do you monitor it?
No, huh-uh.

A.
Q.

Do you read it? Do you keep track of it?
Not per se, no.

9

A.
Q.

10

Do you ever have cause to visit it?
I have gone on it, yes.

11 12
13

A.
Q.

And for what purpose?

A.

Mainly, i would say to see to it that things are

14 okay, are correct, as far as content.

15

Q.

All right. If something wasn't correct, what

16 steps would you take?
17

A.

I would call the person who was the maintenance

18 person or the person who maintains it. We would email him
19 and tell him that there's a mistake and it has to be

20 corrected.
21 22
Q.
All right. Who is that person?

A.
Q.

Martin Spratt.
The Australian?
The Australian.

23
24

A.
Q.

25

Is he in Australia?

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1 BY MR. SHOEMAKER:
2

Q.
"

All right. Going back, the council of elders,

3 you have -- Bethel Aram has three elders; is that correct?
4

A.
Q.
-

Uh-huh.
Each of these three has an equal vote in Bethel

5

6 Aram affairs?
7 8

A.
Q.

Yes, they do.

Does David Bordon have a role in forming

9 corporation soles?

10
11

A.
Q.
C'

No, he does not.
He's not involved in that --

l2
13
14

A.
Q.,.

No.
-- aspect of Bethel Aram Ministries --

A.
Q.

No.
-- those

15

sorts of affairs?

16
17

A.
Q.

Affairs, no.

How about with respect to LLCs or trusts?

18

A.
Q.

No.
All right. All right. Can you remember anything

19

20 else we talked about earlier with your wife that needs to

21 be covered?

22

A.

Let me see my notes real quick.

23
24

No.

MRS. GARDNER: Next page.
THE WITNESS: As it pertains to trusts, LLCs

25

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1 or anything in general that you asked her that we wanted

2 to go back to.

3 BY MR. SHOEMAER:
4

Q.

Well, it's probably not important at this point,

5 so we can drop it.
6 7

A.
Q.

All right.
Let me ask you: Whose idea was it to form Bethel

8 Aram Ministries?
9

A.

When we were -- had a ministry in -- we lived in

10 Phoenix at the particular
11
Q."
Ilm sorry. "We" means you and your wife; is that

12 correct?
13

A. J

Yes. We lived in Phoenix, and we were pastoring

14 in a home church that grew to 65 people. And so at that 15 time, we formed Bethel Arar Ministries. And it was solely 16 as the church for the group. We hadn't talked about the
1 7 possibility of going out and buying a building or

18 anything, but we were meeting in our garage at that time,

19 65 people. And then -20
MRS. GARDNER: We all decided.
THE WITNESS: -- we all decided, you know,
everybody decided maybe we

21

22 the whole congregation

23 better form a ministry so that people can

24

MRS. GARDNER: Identify.
THE WITNESS: -- identify us.

25

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