Oracle America, Inc. v. Google Inc.

Filing 505

EXHIBITS re #503 Declaration in Support, (Exhibits L through R) filed by Oracle America, Inc. (Attachments: #1 Exhibit M, #2 Exhibit N, #3 Exhibit O, #4 Exhibit P, #5 Exhibit Q, #6 Exhibit R)(Related document(s) #503 ) (Muino, Daniel) (Filed on 10/7/2011) Modified on 10/11/2011 (wsn, COURT STAFF).

Highly Confidential Attorneys' Eyes Only
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UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

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NORTHERN DISTRICT OF CALIFORNIA

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SAN FRANCISCO DIVISION

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ORACLE AMERICA, INC.,

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Plaintiff,

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vs.

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GOOGLE, INC.,

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Defendant.

No. CV 10-03561 WHA

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______________________________)

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-- HIGHLY CONFIDENTIAL, ATTORNEYS' EYES ONLY--

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Videotaped deposition of OWEN ASTRACHAN, PH.D.,

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taken at King & Spalding, LLP,

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333 Twin Dolphin Drive, Redwood Shores, California,

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commencing at 9:29 a.m., on

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Friday, September 9, 2011,

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before Leslie Rockwood, RPR, CSR No. 3462.

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minutes left.

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MR. KUWAYTI:

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Just a heads up.

Q.

That's about right.

Do you believe that there is creativity in

the choice of the names -- of any of these names?

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A.

I'm asking -- I'm -- if you're asking in

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deciding what to name a method, does the designer

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18:35:30

exercise any creativity?

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Q.

Yes.

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A.

And my answer would be even though those

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names are largely driven by functional concerns, there

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are certainly choices you can make about whether the name

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should be length or size or total length.

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18:35:47

And when you make those choices, it's

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reasonable to think that you're -- you know, the choice

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itself has some creativity, but the name itself is

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functional, but you're making a choice between .size and

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.length.

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me that that's creative.

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really matter which one you choose.

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would call that a creative choice.

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Is that creative?

Q.

18:36:09

That's -- it's not clear to

That's a choice, and it doesn't
So I'm not sure I
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When you add up the 8,000 choices that went

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into choosing all these different names and organizing

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them, would you agree that there's at least minimal

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creativity involved in that process?

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MR. BABER:

Object to the form.

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THE WITNESS:

I would not agree that if you

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add up 8,000 epsilons that you get anything other than

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epsilons.

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definition of if there's no -- if there's little to no

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creativity in each individual one, but somehow that

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little -- when you add up all the littles, do you get

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something, and I don't think that you can make that

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conclusion.

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Q.

And I'm using, kind of, a mathematical

BY MR. KUWAYTI:

18:36:58

In your opening report at

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paragraph 62 -- beginning at paragraph 62, you gave some

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examples of where you believe that Oracle and Sun have

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implemented various APIs.

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A.

Yes, I did.

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Q.

And my question is:

18:37:09

Did you do anything to

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research whether there was a license to use these APIs by

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Oracle or Sun?

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A.

No.

Q.

18:37:30

I didn't look to see if there was a

Did you do any research to see whether there

license.

was permission given to Oracle or Sun to use these APIs?
A.

18:37:48

I didn't do research, but I'm reasonably

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confident that no agreement was made with Visicalc, for

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example, to include those method names, because I don't

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think -- from Oracle or Sun, between StarOffice and

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OpenOffice.

I don't -- I'm assuming they did not talk to

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the originators of Visicalc.

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That's an assumption.

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could be wrong.

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Q.

And you're assuming that why, because --

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A.

Because I'm thinking that the originators of

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Visicalc probably aren't around as part of Visicalc.

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They're certainly around as part of being guys that are

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still alive.

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Q.

Right.

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A.

Correct.

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Q.

Do you know if in any of these cases was

18:38:25

The company's not around anymore?

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anybody claiming that these APIs at issue were

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18:38:36

proprietary?

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A.

I don't know whether there was any -- there

were any such claims, no.

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Q.

Did you read -- did you do research to

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determine how much of the API was used, whether it was

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just the names or whether it was the organizational

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structure?

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A.

18:38:47

No.

My report talks about the names, and so

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I was concentrating on the fact that the names were the

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same in these two, and I didn't look to see how those

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names might be organized within the different

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spreadsheets, because we're talking about the spreadsheet

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example.

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Q.

Okay.

So my last question is:

Do you have

18:39:02

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any opinions -- any additional opinions that aren't

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reflected in your report and that you haven't already

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discussed here at the deposition today with respect to

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Dr. Mitchell's reply report?

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opinions to offer?

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A.

Are you asking about his last report?

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Q.

His last report or -- do you have any new

Do you have any additional
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opinions that aren't reflected in your reports, I guess

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is my question?

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A.

No.

I -- no.

I don't think I have new

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opinions that aren't reflected in my reports, other --

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new ones.

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18:39:43

hadn't had, but I don't have any other opinions.

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I mentioned earlier about the names that I

MR. KUWAYTI:

Okay.

I have no further

questions.

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MR. BABER:

All right.

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THE VIDEOGRAPHER:

I have no questions.

This marks the end of

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Volume 1, Disk 4, and concludes the deposition of

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Professor Owen Astrachan.

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are off the record.

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MR. BABER:

The time is 6:40 p.m., and we
18:40:09

And on the non-video record, we

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do reserve our rights to read and sign.

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rights to read and sign.

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(TIME NOTED:

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We exercise our

6:40 p.m.)
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