Viacom International, Inc. et al v. Youtube, Inc. et al

Filing 324

DECLARATION of William M. Hohengarten/ Additional Unsealed Exhibits to the Declaration of William M. Hohengarten in Support of Viacom's Motion for Partial Summary Judgment in Support in Support re: 176 MOTION for Partial Summary Judgment /Viacom's Notice of Motion for Partial Summary Judgment on Liability and Inapplicability of the Digital Millennium Copyright Act Safe Harbor Defense.. Document filed by Country Music Television, Inc., Paramount Pictures Corporation, Viacom International, Inc., Black Entertainment Television, LLC, Comedy Partners. (Attachments: # 1 Exhibit 312 - Part 1, # 2 Exhibit 312 - Part 2, # 3 Exhibit 312 - Part 3, # 4 Exhibit 313, # 5 Exhibit 315 - Part 1, # 6 Exhibit 315 - Part 2, # 7 Exhibit 315 - Part 3)(Hohengarten, William)

Page i
UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

FOR THE SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK

VIACOM INTERNATIONAL, INC., COMEDY )

PARTNERS, COUNTRY MUSIC ) TELEVISION, INC., PARAMOUNT )
PICTURES CORPORATION, and BLACK ) ENTERTAINMENT TELEVISION, LLC, )

vs. ) NO. 07-CV-2203
)

Plaintiffs, )
) )

)

YOUTUBE, INC., YOUTUBE, LLC, )

and GOOGLE, INC., ) Defendants. )
)

)

THE FOOTBALL ASSOCIATION PREMIER )
LEAGUE LIMITED, BOURNE CO., et al.,)

on behalf of themselves and all )

others similarly situated, )

P 07 f CV vs . ) NO. lainti-fs, ) - 3 582 YO GUTUOGINC.,, INC.,and) O BE, LE YOUTUBE, LLC, )
) )

Defendants. )
)

)

VIDEOTAPED DEPOSITION OF JAWED KARIM PALO ALTO, CALIFORNIA
TUESDA Y, JUNE 9, 2009

JOB NO. 16798

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 (212) 705 - 8585
259c25e~fd4e-4fb6.808d.35a1 f24e5aa1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

,

Page 2
1

KARIM / JAWED

2
3

JUNE 9/ 2009
10:11 a.m.

4 5
6

VIDEOTAPED DEPOSITION OF JAWED KARIM,
held at the offices of WILSON / SONSINI,

7
B

GOODRICH & ROSATI, 601 California Avenue /

Palo Alto / California / pursuant to notice /
before R. CHAYO AYON, CLR, CSR License
No. 12372.

9

10 11 12
13 14 15

16

17 18
19

20

21
22 23

24 25

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef .fd4e-4 fb6.808d.35a 1 f24e5aa 1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

Page 3
1

KARIM / JAWED

2
3 4 5 6

A P PEA RAN C E S:
FOR THE PLAINTIFFS VIACOM INTERNATIONAL, INC.:

SHEARMA & STERLING, LLP
BY: STUART J. BASKIN / ESQ.

7 8 9

599 Lexington Avenue

New York, New York 10022-6069

[phone] [e-mail]

10
11 12 13

FOR THE PLAINTIFFS VIACOM INTERNATIONAL INC.:
JENNER & BLOCK / LLP

BY: SUSAN J. KOHLMANN / ESQ.
SCOTT B. WILKENS / ESQ.

14 15 16 17
18

1099 New York Avenue NW
Suite 900

Washington, D.C. 20001

[phone] [e-mail]

19

20 FOR THE LEAD PLAINTIFFS AND PROSPECTIVE CLASS:

21 BERNSTEIN / LITOWITZ / BERGER & GROSSMA f LLP
22
23 24

BY: JOHN BROWNE / ESQ.

1285 Avenue of the Americas

New York, New York 10019

25

[phone] [e-mail]

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef -fd4e-4fb6-BOBd-35a 1 f24e5aa 1

Page 4
1

KARIM / JAWED

2 A P PEA RAN C E S (Continued.)
3

4 FOR THE DEFENDANTS YOUTUBE / INC. / YOUTUBE / LLC / and

5 GOOGLE / INC.:

6 MAYER BROWN / LLP
7
8

BY: MATTHEW D. INGBER, ESQ.
BRIAN WILLEN / ESQ.

9

1675 Broadway

10 11
12

New York, New York 10019-5820

[phone] [e-mail]

13 FOR THE WITNESS:

14 DURIE / TANGRI, PAGE / LEMLEY/ROBERTS &

15 KENT / LLP
16 17 18 19

BY: MICHAEL H. PAGE / ESQ.
332 Pine Street / Suite 200

San Francisco, California 94104

(415) 362 -6666 [e-mail]

20

21 ALSO PRESENT:

22 KELL Y TRUELOVE / Ph. D /

23 TRUELOVE RESEARCH, CONSULTANT FOR VIACOM

24 LOU MEADOWS / VIDEOGRAPHER
25

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25e~fd4e-4fb6-808d-35a1f24e5aa1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

Page 5
1

KARIM / JAWED

2
3

PALO ALTO, CALIFORNIA, JUNE 9/ 2009
10:11 a.m. to 5:23 p.m.

4 5

PROCEEDINGS

10:11:37
10:11:38 10:11:44

6 7
8

THE VIDEOGRAPHER: This is today' s

videotaped deposition of Jawed Karim, taken on June
9/ 2009/ at Wilson, Sonsini, Goodrich & Rosati,
601 California / San Jose / California

10:11:49
10:11:52

9

excuse me

10

Palo Alto, California, in the matter of Viacom
International i Inc. / vs. YouTube / Inc. / and The

10:11:58 10:11:58
10:12:00

11
12
13

Football Association Premier League vs. YouTube,
Inc. / et al. / case number 07-CV-2103 and 07-CV-3582

10:12:10
10: 12: 14

14
15

in the United States District Court for the Southern
District of New York.
My name is Lou Meadows / and I represent

10:12:15 10:12:17
10: 12: 20

16 17
18

David Feldman Worldwide, located at 600 Anton
Boulevard, Suite 1100/ in Costa Mesa, California.

10:12:22

19 20
21

We are now commencing at 10: 11 a. m.
Will all counsel present please identify
themselves and state whom they represent for the

10:12:27

10:12:29
10:12:32
10:12:32

22
23

record.
MR. PAGE: Michael Page of Durie Tangri,
representing the witness.

10:12:36
10:12:36

24 25

MR. INGBER: Matthew Ingber, Mayer Brown,

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef.d4e-4 fb6.808d -35a 1 f24e5aa 1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

Page 6
1

KARIM, JAWED representing Google and YouTube.

10:12:36 10:12:40
10:12:42

2
3 4 5

MR. WILLEN: Brian Willen from Mayer Brown,
representing Google and YouTube.

10:12:42
10:12:45

MR. BASKIN; I'm Stuart Baskin from
Shearman & Sterling, representing Viacom.

6 7
8

10:12:49 10:12:49
10:12:49
10:12:58

MR. WILKINS: Scott Wilkins from Jenner &
Block, representing Viacom.

9

MS. KOHLMAN: Susan Kohlmann from Jenner &
Block, representing Viacom.

10
11
12 13

10:12:58 10:12:59
10:12:59
10: 13: 04

MR. BROWNE: John Browne from Bernstein,
Litowitz, Berger & Grossman on behalf of The

Premiere League and The Class.
MR. TRUELOVE: Kelly Truelove, consultant
for Viacom.

14

10:13:06

15
16

THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Thank you. I f there are

i 7 no stipulations / the court reporter may now

18 administer the oath.

19 JAWED KARIM,
20 called as a witness by the Plaintiffs and who,
21 having been by me duly sworn, was thereupon examined

22 and testified as hereinafter set forth.

23 EXAMINATION
24 BY MR. BASKIN:
10:13:20
25

Q. Good morning.

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef-fd4e-4fb6-808d.35a 1 f24e5aa 1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

Page
1

7

KARIM, JAWED

10:13:20 10:13:21 10:13:27 10:13:31
10:13:41 10:13:44 10:13:48 10:13:50 10:13:52

2 3 4 5
6

A.
Q.

Hi.
How

old

are you?

A.
Q.

Thirty.
You are a very young- looking 30.

Tell us

a

little bit about yourself. The -- let me show you
your resume printed from, I think, your Web site,

7
8

and maybe you can tell us a little bit about

9

yourself.
MR. BASKIN: So why don i t we mark as -Exhibit 1?

10
11 12
13

10:13:54
10:13:54 10:14:04 10:14:04

(Plaintiffs' Exhibit No. 1 was marked for

identification. )
MR. PAGE: I object that it calls for a
narrative. If you want to ask him a real question,
go ahead.

14 15 16

10:14:07
10:14:12

10:14:12
10: 14: 34

17
18

MR. BASKIN: I'LL ask him questions.
BY MR. BASKIN:

10:14:35

19 20 21

Q. I take it you have an undergraduate degree
from the University of Illinois in Urbana-Champaign?

10:14:37
10:14:43

A. Yeah.

10:14:44

22
23 24

Q. And -- and what, in particular, in
connection with computer science and engineering,

10:14:47
10:14:50 10:14:51

what did you study there?
A. I was a - - undergraduate degree in computer

25

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef-fd4e-4fb6.808d .35a 1 f24e5aa 1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

Page 8
1

KARIM, JAWED

10:14:58

2
3

science. Soi you know, the curriculum was, you
know / operating systems / computer graphics /

10:15:07
10:15:13

4 5
6

networking. So kind of the whole broad curriculum.

10:15:19 10:15:22

Q. And what are you studying now with Stan- -do you have a degree from Stanford now / a graduate

10:15:27
10:15:28 10:15:30

7
8

degree?
A. I have a Master's degree.

9

Q. And also in computer science?

10:15:31
10: 15: 32

10 11 12 13
14

A. Uh-huh.

10:15:34 10:15:34

Q. What in particular did you study at Stanford?

A. So I studied - - it i S called systems.
That i S the area.

10:15:39 10:15:41
10:15:48

15 16

Q. And since I i m pretty technologicaiiy
illiterate, why don't you tell me what "systems" is.

10:15:50
10:15:55 10:16:01 10:16:06

17
18

A. Sure. So systems is basically -- sort of
the interface between operating systems / networking /

19 20

databases. It's kind of a combination of several

fields.
Q.

10:16:07 21 10:16:15 22 10:16:17 23
10:16:29 24
Does

By the way, is
I think it looks
Okay.
Now,

is Exhibit
correct.
me a

1 your resume?

it look to
A.
Q.

you to be such?

tell

little

bit about

what

10: 16 : 32 25

you did

at

PayPal back in the period you were

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef-fd4e-4fb6-80Bd -35a1 f24e5aa 1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

Page 9
1

KARIM, JAWED

10:16:35 10:16:38

2
3

associated with them, 2000 through 2005?

A. Uh-huh. So I helped to build the Web site.
And some of the stuff I did later was related to -scaleability was kind of my main contribution
because the system expanded to / you know / I think

10:16:47 10:16:58 10:17:05
10:17:08

4 5
6

7
8 9

like a hundred million users. And so I - - I was
part of the architecture on our team.

10:17:10 10:17:15 10:17:20 10:17:20 10:17:25 10:17:26

Q. And did you go to PayPal right out of -right out of college?

10

11
12
13

A. Well/actually during college, because I
was still an undergrad.

Q. When you were there?

10:17:27 10:17:28
10:17:34 10:17:38
10:17:38

14 15

A. Yeah.
Q. Now, when PayPal was sold -- what, in early
2002? Is that October 2002 PayPal was sold?

16 17 18 19 20 21 22
23 24

A. Uh-huh.
Q. Did you receive a payment in
connection with the sale of PayPal?

in

10:17:40
10:17:42
10:17:44

A. I mean, there was -- I had stock options,
and so that didn't really change when it was sold.
i still had the same stock options.

10:17;47 10:17:49
10:17:52

Q. And how much were your stock options worth
on the sale of PayPal?

10:17:55

25

A. Upon?

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef-fd4e-4fb6-80Bd.35a1 f24e5aa1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

Page 10 E:
1

KARIM / JAWED

10:17:56 10:17:58 10:17:58 10:17:59 10:18:00

2
3

MR. PAGE: Object that it calls for

speculation.
THE WITNESS: I don't know really the exact

4 5
6

amount.
BY MR. BASKIN:

10:18:00 10:18:01
10:18:05

7 8 9

Q. Give me an approximate amount.

A. Upon the sale, I think -- I think it might

have been maybe _.
Q. And your next immediate job after PayPal
was at YouTube? Or was - - was there a period of
time when you were employed at another Web site

10:18:10 10:18:12 10:18:16 10:18:19 10:18:22
10:18:26

10 11 12
13

cal led Trepia?
A. Let i s see. So that's a company I founded.

14 15

Q. And it's -- it's not on this particular
resume, but when did you found -- found Trepia?

10:18:35

16
17 18

10:18:39
10:18:46

A. Let i s see. I think it was - - I think it
might have been maybe 2002/ maybe. 2003.
Q.

10:18:50 19 10:18:53 20

Upon the

A.

sale of PayPal? I think it was - - I think

it was

after the

10: 18 : 58 21
10:18:59 22
10:19:04 23

sale of PayPal.
Q.

And what was your position at Trepia?
It was founder and CEO.

A.
Q.

10:19:10 24
10:19:12
25

And what - - what

--

what was or

is

is

Trepia stiii around today?

805 Third Avenue; New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef.fd4e-4fb6-808d-35a1f24e5aa1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

Page 16
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KARIM, JAWED
go at it a different way.
When - - when YouTube was first starting up /

10:27:23

2 3 4 5 6

10:27:24 10:27:32 10:27:35 10:27:35 10:27:38

I take it there were three founders; is that

correct?
A.
Q.

Yes.
And you were one

7
8
9

of the three; correct?

10:27:41
10:27:43

A.
Q.

Uh-huh.

And the second founder was named Chad

10:27:46

10 11 12
13 14

Hurley; correct?
A.
Q.

10:27:47
10:27:48
10:27:53 10:27:53

Yes.

And the third founder was Mr. Chen, Steven
Uh-huh.
Did you know all

Chen?
A.
Q.

10:27:54

15 16

three of

these gentlemen

10:27:56
10:27:58 10:27:58 10:28:00
10:28:01 10:28:01
10:28:03

from PayPal?

17
18

MR. PAGE: Two.
MR. BASKIN; Strike that. You're

19

absolutely right.
BY MR. BASKIN;

20
21 22 23 24 25

Q. Do you know the other two gentlemen from

PayPal?
A. Yes, uh-huh.
Q. And they'd worked with you at PayPal at the

10:28:04

10:28:05
10:28:10

time?

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef -fd4e-4fb6.808d-35a 1 f24e5aa 1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

Page 28
1

KARIM / JAWED

10:45:20 10:45:24
10: 45: 27

2
3

Q. How did you go about - - strike that.

Did you personally collect the documents

4

that l S been produced in this matter?
MR. PAGE: Objection, vague -- vague and

10:45:29
10:45:33

5
6 7 8
9

ambiguous.
Do you want to ask about the documents he's
produced in this matter?

10:45:34

10:45:38

10:45:39
10:45:40

THE WITNESS: I think -BY MR. BASKIN:

10
11 12
13 14

10:45:41
10:45:42

Q. With respect to the documents you produced
in this matter / how did you go about collecting

10:45:47
10:45:47 10:45:50
10:45:53

them?
A. I think I kept a copy of the consulting
agreement, and I just put them, you know, in a

15 16 17 18 19

folder.
Q. What about the various documents that bear

10:45:53 10:45:57
10:46:03

your JK and have been produced in this matter?
How did you collect those electronically?

10:46:06 10:46:11

20 21 22
23

MR. PAGE: Obj ection as vague and

ambiguous.
THE WITNESS: You know / those - - those were

10:46:11
10:46:14
10:46:20 10:46:22

all documents produced as a result of / you know/my
invol vement with You

24 25

Tube .

So for example, the e-mails, you know, any
i.

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef-fd4e-4fb6-808d-35a 1 f24e5aa1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE i INC.

Page 29
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KARIM, JAWED
e-mails that - - that I wrote and recei ved, those

10:46:29
10:46:31 10:46:34

2
3

were all in my e-mail file.
BY MR. BASKIN:

4 5 6

10:46:36 10:46:37 10:46:38 10:46:42
10:46:42

Q. E-mail - - I'm sorry. Were you done?

A. Yeah.
Q. The e-mail file on your own personal

7
8

computer?
A. So you're asking me where the e-mails came

9

10:46:47

10

from?
Q. Yes.
A. So the e-mails were a combination of two
e-mail accounts. I used my personal e-mail kind of
early on, before there was a YouTube, you know, kind
of e-mail address for everyone.

10:46:47
10:46:48 10:46:52 10:46:59 10:47:05 10:47:08
10:47:14 10:47:18

11 12
13

14 15 16

And then - - and then there was al so the
e-mails that I used from the YouTube e-mail account.

17
18 19

So two - - so the e-mails were in two
accounts. Initially in the personal account, and
then later / once we had the YouTube e-mail. then I

10:47:21 10:47:24
10:47:28

20 21
22
23 24

think everyone used the YouTube e-mail account.

10:47:34

Q. And who searched your personal account
e-mail account for e-mails to produce in this

10:47:39
10:47:45 10:47:47

matter? Did you do it personally?

25

MR. PAGE: Obj ection as vague and

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef.fd4e-4fb6-80Bd-35a1f24e5aa1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

Page 30
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KARIM / JAWED

10:47:48

2
3

ambiguous.
THE WITNESS; There was a collection
process at Wilson, Sonsini / I believe. And so i --

10:47:48 10:47:52 10:48:00 10:48:04 10:48:10
10:48:14

4
5

I brought in, you know, all of my e-mails. And the
person responsible for the collection, I - - I worked

6 7 8
9

with him to extract the YouTube related e-mails from
all those e-mails.

10:48:15

BY MR. BASKIN:

10:48:15 10:48:18 10:48:19
10:48:26

10 11 12
13 14

Q. So you worked with a Wilson, Sonsini

lawyer?
A. There was a - - it was someone employed by
Wilson, Sonsini who was there who I worked with.

10:48:29
10:48:33

Q. In your YouTube e-mail account - - strike

15
16

that.
Did you follow the same procedure with
respect to your YouTube e-mail account?

10:48:33 10:48:35

17
18 19 20

10:48:37
10:48:46

A. With the YouTube e-mail account / the
procedure for collecting those e-mails was

10:48:50
10:48:50
10:48:53 10:48:59 10:49:06 10:49:07

different.
Q. Okay. And what was that procedure?

21
22 23

A. That procedure was to simply copy/you
know / sent and received e-mails in - - in all other

24 25

e-mail folders. Q. And did you participate in that process?
DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef-fd4e-4fb6-80Bd-35a1f24e5aa1

Page 31
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KARIM, JAWED
A. Let i s see. My participation was to simply /

10:49:10

2
3

10:49:18
10:49:18 10:49:22
10:49:23 10:49:33

you know/transfer the data.
Q. Um -MR. BASKIN: By the way, just for the

4 5
6

record, let i s mark as Exhibit 3 a letter dated
June 14/ 2006.
(Plaintiffs l Exhibit No. 3 was marked for

7
8

10:49:33

10:49:42 10:49:42
10:49:43

9

identification. )
BY MR. BASKIN:

10 11
12

Q. I III ask you to see if you can identify
that for us.

10:49:45
10:49:46

13 14
15

A. (Document review.)

10:50:41
10:50:44

Q. Does Exhibit 3 appear to you to be a copy
of the termination letter that you received from
Mr. Hurley on and around June 14/ 2006?

10:50:46
10: 50: 51

16 17
18

A. I think so.
Q. And am I correct that as part of the
termination process / there was an adj ustment made to

10:51:01 10:51:15

19 20

10:51:19 10:51:22
10:51:23 10:51:44

the 1.2 million shares that you had received under
your consulting agreement?

21 22
23

MR. PAGE; Obj ect as vague and ambiguous.
THE WITNESS: I think - - I think the table
outlines a change.
BY MR. BASKIN:

10:51:47 10:51:49

24 25

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef-fd4e4 fb6-808d -35a1 f24e5aa 1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

Page 106
1

KARIM, JAWED Exhibit 27?

13:07:51
13:07:52
13: 07 : 53

2
3

A. I think so.

4
5 6

Q. And accordingly, did you receive Exhibit 27
on or around - - in and around September 2 / 2005?

13:07:59
13: 08 : 02

MR. PAGE: Object as to form.
THE WITNESS; I think I probably did
receive this e-mail.

13:08:05
13:08:07
13:08:13

7 8 9

MR. BASKIN: Shall we take a short break,

13:08:16
13: 08: 18

10 11 12
13 14 15 16

or make it a lunch break, for that matter. It i s
1: 10.
THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Off the record. The
time is 1;07 p.m.

13:08:18 13:08:21 13:08:21 13:08:21

(Lunch recess taken from 1:07 p.m. to
2:02 p.m.)

14:02:57
14:02:57
14:02:58

AFTERNOON SESSION

17
18

THE VIDEOGRAPHER: On the record. The time
is 2:02 p.m. Please continue.
BY MR. BASKIN;

14:03:20 14:03:21 14:03:25 14:03:28 14:03:30 14:03:35 14:03:38

19 20 21
22 23

24 25

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef-fd4e-4fb6.808d.35a1 f24e5aa1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

Page 107
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KARIM, JAWED

14:03:41 14:03:44

2
3

14:03:44

4
5 6

14:03:47 14:03:49
14:03:51

7
8

14:03:56
14:03:56

9

Q. Did you work - - did you perform work during
your time at YouTube on the administrative part of
the Web site, the administrative interface?

14:04:16
14:04:23

10 11
12 13

14:04:27
14: 04: 30

MR. INGBER: Objection, vague and
ambiguous.
THE WITNESS: What do you mean by

14:04:30
14:04:32
14: 04: 33

14 15 16 17 18 19

nadministrativen?
BY MR. BASKIN:

14:04:34

Q. Well/am I correct that a - - that part of
the software - - that part of the design of the Web

14:04:40
14:04:43
14: 04: 4 9

site was an administrative component of the Web
site / which only high level executives of YouTube

20 21
22 23 24

14; 04: 54

had access to?

14:04:56

MR. INGBER: Objection, vague and
ambiguous.
MR. PAGE; And compound.
THE WITNESS: There was an interface where

14:04:57 14:04:57 14:04:58

25

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef.fd4e-4fb6.808d .35a 1f24e5aa 1

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MR. PAGE: Obj ection, misstates
BY MR. BASKIN:

4
5 6 7 8

Q. Is that your testimony?

14:17:21
14: 17: 22

MR. PAGE: prior testimony.
THE WITNESS: I wouldn't say

14:17:24 14:17:28

"oversimplification/" but simplification.
BY MR. BASKIN:

14:17:28
14:17:30
14:17:34

9

Q. So how many -- let me just -- so we're
talking about the same thing/let me show you what
we'll mark as Exhibit 29.
(Plaintiffs i Exhibit No. 29 was marked for

10 11
12
13

14:17:34 14:18:12 14:18:12 14:18:14

identification. )
THE WITNESS; Thanks.
(Document review.)

14

15

14:18:32
14:18:32 14:18:36
14 :18 :43

16
17 18

BY MR. BASKIN:

Q. Is Exhibit 29 -- strike that.
Was Exhibit 29 sent by you in and around
April 20, 2005?

19
20

14:18:44

A. Yes.
Q. Now / I take it this is the e-mail that you
referenced a few seconds ago; is that correct?
MR. PAGE: Obj ection, misstates his

14:19:07

21
22 23

14:19:09
14:19:12
14:19:14

24 25

testimony.
THE WITNESS: I don 1 t know if it was this

14:19:15

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef-fd4e-4fb6-808d-35a 1 f24e5aa 1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE i INC.

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2
3

particular e-mail.
BY MR. BASKIN:

4
5 6 7 8
9

Q. We 1 i 1 towards the bot tom of Exhibit 29/
there's a sentence that begins, "If videos get
floodeĦd with porn" -- and then it goes on to talk
about - - "we could always approve videos first

before they are shown anywhere. That's a one-line

code change."
Do you see that / sir?

14:19:41 14:19:42
14:19:43

10
11 12
13 14

A. Uh-huh.
Q. Is that the sentence that you i re telling us

14:19:46 14:19:49
14: 19: 53

is now a simplification?
A. I mean / you know / most changes are not

15
16

one-line code changes. It's used as an expression
to say that something is fairly simple, but it may

14:19:56

14:20:00 14:20:01 14:20:05
14:20:08 14:20:13 14:20:15 14:20:15
14: 20: 17

17
18

not be one line.
Q. But as I understand it, to make this change
would have been

19
20 21

for someone like you/ would have

been a very simple thing to undertake; right?

MR. INGBER: Objection, vague and

22
23 24
25

ambiguous.
THE WITNESS: It would have been a pretty
simple change.

14:20:18

BY MR. BASKIN:

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef.fd4e-4fb6-80Bd.35a 1 f24e5aa 1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

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2
3

Q. Now, was there a decision made within
YouTube in and around April of 2005 not to permit the administrative interface to block videos from
going - - from being viewed prior to review?

14: 20: 24

14:20:31

4 5 6

14:20:37
14:20:42

MR. PAGE: Obj ection, vague and ambiguous.
THE WITNESS; Um, so this was discussed

14:20:47 14:20:55

7
8

before the Web site launched. So actually /
everything we discuss at this point is really
subj ect to / you know / changing / and we were

14:20:59
14:21:01 14:21:06

9

10

11
12 13

considering different possibilities.
BY MR. BASKIN;

14:21:09
14: 21: 09

Q. My question is: Was a decision made -when the administrative interface went live, was a

14:21:14

14

14:21:19
14:21:24

15 16
17 18

decision made not to write the code to permit review
of videos by the interface prior to their being
displayed to the public?

14:21:29
14:21:31

A. Um, I don't know if - - so you i re asking me
about the initial kind of implementation of the -of this interface?

14:21:39
14:21:43 14:21:45

19

20 21 22
23 24 25

I think it probably varied. I think, you
know -- this is before the Web site launched. I
think we probably tried out different approaches.
So I wouldn l t be surprised if we had tried both of

14:21:49
14:21:52 14:21:55 14:21:58

those approaches.

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef.fd4e-4fb6-808d-35a1f24e5aa1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

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Q. Well/one possibility was to review videos
before they became publicly available; correct?

4 5
6 7

A. That i s one of the possibilities.
Q. And was that possibility ever adopted by
YouTube, to your knowledge?

14:22:07
14: 22: 10

14:22:11 14:22:13 14:22:14
14: 22: 17

MR. INGBER: Objection, vague.
THE WITNESS: I don i t remember / but I think

8
9

it's very possible that we used both approaches.
BY MR. BASKIN:

10
11

14:22:18
14:22:21
14: 22: 22

Q. When did you use both approaches /
Mr. Karim?

12
13 14 15 16

MR. PAGE: Objection, misstates his prior

14:22:24

testimony.
MR. INGBER: Same obj ection.
THE WITNESS; I don't remember exactly when
but these

14:22:27
14:22:28 14:22:30
14:22:32

17 18 19

the approaches changed / I 'm pret ty

sure.
BY MR. BASKIN:

14:22:32
14:22:32 14:22:37
14: 22: 42 14: 22: 44

20 21 22
23

Q. Can you tell us any period of time when the
interface was set up to review videos before they
became publicly available?

A. I don i t know the time frame. I think it i s
very likely that that was the case for some time.

14:23:01
14:23:03

24
25

Q. What time / sir?

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef-fd4e-4fb6-808d-35a1 f24e5aa1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

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14:36:00 14:36:01
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2
3

Q. When you were involved with the site.

A. Until what date?
Q. Until you ceased being involved with the

4
5

site.
MR. INGBER: Obj ection as to "involved."

14:36:05
14: 36: 06

6 7 8
9

THE WITNESS; Def ine 11 invol ved. 11

14:36:08

MR. INGBER: Vague as to 11 invol ved. II
BY MR. BASKIN:

14:36:10
14:36:11
14:36:13

10
11 12
13 14

Q. Until

until the period of time when you

were terminated. From your start - - start with the
site until when you were terminated from the site,

14:36:16 14:36:21

could a YouTube user upload a video and switch it
from public to private at his will?

14:36:27
14:36:30
14:36:32

15 16 17
18

A. 11m not certain about the time after I was
no longer full-time with the company, after

14:36:36 14:36:38 14:36:39
14:36:48

September 2005/ but before that I know that users

could do that.

19

Q. Now/am I right that if a content provider
wanted to search for its content on YouTube / it had

20
21

14:36:51
14:36:54

no access to what was switched to private videos;

22
23

correct?
MR. INGBER: Objection, vague and
ambiguous / calls for speculation.

14:36:54

14:36:56

24 25

14:36:57

THE WITNESS: What time frame?

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 (212) 705 -8585
259c25ef-fd4e-4fb6-808d-35a1f24e5aa1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

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BY MR. BASKIN:

14:36:58

2 3 4
5

14:36:59
14:37:03

Q. Let i s take your - - your past time frame.
Up until September 2005/ am I correct that a content provider who wanted to search the site for
its intellectual property had no access to the
private videos?
MR.

14:37:06
14:37:11 14:37:15
14:37:16

6 7 8 9

INGBER:

Same obj ections .
What

14:37:20 14:37:21 14:37:29

THE WITNESS:
MR.

is

the objection?

10 11 12
13

INGBER:

Vague and ambiguous /

calls for

speculation.
THE WITNESS:

14:37:29
14:37:33

I mean, private videos, you

couldn't / you know / have access to if it wasn i t

14:37:36 14:37:40 14:37:44 14:37:45

14 15 16

being shared with the person who - - if it wasn i t
shared with you. So you couldn't just find it on

the site.
BY MR. BASKIN:

17
18

14:37:47
14:38:19
14:38:23

Q. Now / do you know whether you had private

19

videos on your site that had been reviewed thousands
of times by - - by viewers?

20 21
22
23

14:38:27
14:38:29
14:38:33

MR. INGBER: Vague and ambiguous as to the
term "your site."
BY MR. BASKIN:

14:38:34 14:38:38

24

Q. With respect to the videos that you
uploaded, sir / to your private video site on

25

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef.fd4e-4fb6-808d-35a 1 f24e5aa 1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

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A. I see Exhibit 45.

16:10:47

Q. Who is Charles Chariya?
A. I think he's an acquaintance of Steve, but
I have not met him.

16:10:49
16:10:52 16:10:54

4 5 6

Q. Was he involved at - - at - - at Yahoo / do
you know?

16:10:59 16:10:59
16: 11 : 05 16: 11 : 06

7
8 9

A. I know that he worked at Yahoo. That's all
I know / though.

10

Q. Do you recall reviewing Exhibit 45?

16:11:10 16:11:13 16:11:14

11 12
13 14

A. I actually do not remember seeing this

before.
Q. Okay. Finally/let me hand you what we r II

16:11:31 16:11:31
16:11:54 16:11:54 16:12:15 16:12:16

mark as Exhibit - - sorry - - 47.
(Plaintiffs' Exhibit No. 47 was marked for

15 16 17 18 19

identification. )
THE WITNESS: (Document review.)
BY MR. BASKIN:

Q. Can you identify for us/ sir, what is
Exhibit 47?

16:12:19

20

16:12:19
16:12:24 16:12:28

21
22
23

A. It's a document I wrote.

Q. And did you write it on or about the date
set forth on the document?

16:12:29
16:12:30

24
25

A. Yes.

Q. And for what purpose did you write this
DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef-fd4e-4fb6-808d-35a 1 f24e5aa 1

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3

document?
A. I just wrote this to communicate some

16:12:37
16:12:49

4 5
6

ideas.
Q. And to whom did you communicate these

16:12:50
16:12:53 16:12:53

ideas?
MR. PAGE; Objection, assumes facts.
THE WITNESS: This was handed out by me at
a board meeting and -- but it was only handed out.

7
8

16:12:57 16:13:01
16: 13 : 07

9

10 11
12 13 14 15

It was not discussed. So I don't know if anyone
other than me actually ever read this.
BY MR. BASKIN:

16:13:09
16: 13 : 11

16:13:11
16:13:13

Q. You - - you were at a board meeting that
occurred on the day after you wrote this memo i

16:13:16 16:13:16

correct?
A. Yes.

16

16:13:17
16:13:23

17
18

Q. And you distributed Exhibit 47 to the
members of the board?

16:13:24

19

A. Yes.

16:13:25 16:13:31 16:13:31
16:13:32
16":13:53

20 21
22
23

Q. And - - but there was no discussion taken at
the meeting at the time?

A. No.

Q. Was there - - was there scheduled to be a
discussion of Exhibit 47 at the board meeting?

24

16:13:56

25

MR. PAGE: Objection, calls for

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef-fd4e-4fb6.808d.35a1f24e5aa1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

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speculation.
THE WITNESS; I remember handing it out at
the board meet ing / and I - - I was jus t an

4
5

observer on the board. I was not - - never a member
of the board.
And I remember / you know / the members /

16:14:12
16:14:13 16:14:16 16:14:18

6 7
8

they're saying / you know / "Thanks. We ' 1 1 check it
out. "
BY MR. BASKIN:

9

16:14:19
16:14:20 16:14:27 16:14:30 16:14:31 16:14:32

10
11 12
13 14

Q. And going into the board meeting/was a
discussion of your memo a scheduled item for the
board meeting?

A. No, it was not.
Q. What caused you to hand it out at the board

15 16 17 18 19 20

16:14:35 16:14:35
16:14:45

meeting?
A. So between board meetings, I would

sometimes, you know/have some ideas. And then I
thought it would be better organized to assemble

16:14:50
16:14:56 16:14:59

them into one document that I could then hand out at
the board meeting.

21 22
23

16:15:00
16:15:05

Q. So was it your practice to hand out
memoranda from time to time at the board meeting?

16:15:07
16:15:11

24

MR. INGBER: Objection, mischaracterizes
his testimony.

25

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef-fd4e-4 fb6-808d -35a 1 f24e5aa 1

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

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3

THE WITNESS: I think it was the only time
I did that, but I would verbally discuss things at

4
5
6

board meetings that I had developed over the
previous month.
BY MR. BASKIN:

16:15:16

16:15:18 16:15:18 16:15:21
16:15:28

7

Q. And was there a reason you recall why you
decided to communicate to the board in writing on
March 23/ 2006/ rather than orally?

8
9

16:15:32 16:15:35 16:15:36
16:15:44

10 11
12 13

A. Because I had accumulated a lot of
different things.

Q. Did you propose at the board meeting that
the board discuss the - - the items set forth in

16:15:48
16:15:48 16:15:52

14 15 16

Exhibit 47?

A. I remember saying / you know / "Here are some

things that I wanted to talk about."

16:15:57 16:15:59
16:16:02 16:16:03
16:16:03

17
18

Q. And did someone make the decision not to
discuss Exhibit 47 at the board meeting?

19
20 21 22
23

MR. INGBER; Obj ection, calls for

speculation.
MR. PAGE; Join.
THE WITNESS; It was - - I handed it out /
and Steve said, "Thanks / I will - - i will look at

16:16:06 16:16:10 16:16:16
16: 16: 22

24 25

it /" and then the meeting proceeded, but not with

this.
DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef-fd4e-4fb6-808d-35a1 f24e5aa 1

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BY MR. BASKIN:

16:16:24

Q. And did there come a time in a subsequent
board meeting when you had occasion to discuss
Exhibit 47 with the board members?

16:16:28 16:16:31
16:16:33

A. No. This was never discussed.
Q. Did there come a time when any member of
the board contacted you to discuss any of the topics
set forth in Exhibit 47?

16:16:39 16:16:42 16:16:46

16:16:47
16:16:48

10

A. No.
Q. Did there come a time when Mr. Hurley
discussed with you the matters set forth in
Exhibit 47?

11
12 13 14

16:16:50 16:16:54 16:16:54 16:16:56
16: 16: 58

MR. PAGE; Objection, asked and answered.
MR. INGBER: Objection, asked and answered.

15
16

MR. PAGE: Stop doing that.
THE WITNESS: This was never brought up by
anyone again after I handed it out.
BY MR. BASKIN:

16:16:59
16:17:03 16:17:05
16: 17: 05

17
18

19
20 21 22 23 24 25

Q. So if I understand, after you handed it out
at the board meeting / no human being associated with

16:17:09
16:17:13 16:17:15
16: 17: 15

YouTube talked to you about this exhibit; is that

correct? A. That i s correct.
Q. And did any human being associated with

16:17:16

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef-fd4e-4fb6-80Bd.35a 1 f24e5aa1

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KARIM / JAWED

YouTube ever e-mail you in connection with this

exhibit?
A. Not that I remember.

4
5 6

Q. Um, in subsequent board meetings / did you
attempt orally to raise any of the items set forth
in Exhibit 47?

16:17:30 16:17:34 16:17:37 16:17:40

7
8

MR. PAGE: Obj ection, assumes facts.
THE WITNESS: No / I did not.
BY MR. BASKIN:

9

16:17:41
16:17:42 16:17:46 16:17:50 16:17:51 16:17:53

10 11
12
13

Q. And at any prior board meeting / did you
discuss the topics set forth in Exhibit 47 orally?

MR. PAGE: Objection, compound.

14 15 16 17 18

THE WITNESS: I didn't.
BY MR. BASKIN;

16:18:27 16:18:31

Q. I have one more document to show you/ sir.

MR. WILLEN: You said that last time.

MR. BASKIN: Yeah, I know_ I made a

19 mistake last time.

20 (Discussion held off the record.) 21 (Plaintiffs' Exhibit No. 48 was marked for 22 identification.)
23 BY MR. BASKIN:
16:20:09
16:20:31
24 25

Q. Let me hand out Exhibit 48.

A. (Document review.)

DAVID FELDMA WORLDWIDE, INC.

805 Third Avenue, New York, New York 10022 [phone]
259c25ef-fd4e-4fb6-808d.35a1 f24e5aa 1