PA Advisors, LLC v. Google Inc. et al

Filing 458

RESPONSE in Opposition re #427 Third MOTION in Limine Defendants' Motion in Limine No. 3 filed by PA Advisors, LLC. (Attachments: #1 Affidavit, #2 Exhibit A)(Wiley, Elizabeth)

EXHIBIT A

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Job No.: 212395 Deposition of ILYA GELLER, taken by and before JOYCE SILVER, a Certified Shorthand Reporter and Notary Public of the State of New York, and, PHILIP GLAUBERSON, Videographer, held at the office of STROOCK, STROOCK & LAVAN, 767 Third Avenue, New York, New York. VS. GOOGLE INC., et al., Defendants. -------------DATE: TIME: UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT EASTERN DISTRICT OF TEXAS MARSHALL DIVISION ---------------------------PA ADVISORS, LLC, Plaintiff, : : : : : : : : : : : NO.2:07-CV-480-DF

August 19, 2009 9:47 a.m.

Veritext Corporate Services 800-567-8658 973-410-4040

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A P P E A R A N C E S: Attorneys for Plaintiff RUSS AUGUST & KABAT 12424 Wilshire Boulevard Los Angeles, California 90025 BY: MARC A. FENSTER, ESQ.

STIPULATIONS IT IS HEREBY STIPULATED AND AGREED by and between the attorneys for the respective parties hereto that filing and sealing be one and the same are hereby waived. IT IS FURTHER STIPULATED AND AGREED that all objections except as to the form of the question, shall be reserved to the time of the trial. IT IS FURTHER STIPULATED AND AGREED that the within examination may be signed and sworn to before any officer authorized to administer an oath or notary public, with the same force and effect as though signed and sworn to before the officer before whom the within deposition was taken.

3 4 5 6 Attorneys for Defendant, Google Inc. QUINN, EMANUEL, URQUHART, OLIVER & HEDGES, LLP 7 555 Twin Dolphin Drive 8 Suite 560 9 Redwood Shores, California 94065 BY: BRIAN C. CANNON, ESQ. 10 And 11 EUGENE NOVIKOV, ESQ. 12 Attorneys for Defendant Yahoo 13 14 HOWREY LLP 15 321 North Clark Street 16 Chicago, Illinois 60654 BY: JASON C. WHITE, ESQ. 17 18 ALSO PRESENT: Erich Spangenberg 19 20 21 22 23 24 25

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INDEX WITNESS DIRECT CROSS REDIRECT RECROSS ILYA GELLER BY MR. CANNON 6 154 BY MR. FENSTER 128 EXHIBITS NUMBER DESCRIPTION PAGE Exhibit 16, Patent Purchase agreement, 101 Bates Nos. PA 0001210-22 Exhibit 17, Panel Summary No. 1 119 Exhibit 18, Letter, Bates Nos. Geller 137 031979-91 Exhibit 19, Letter, Bates No. Geller 139 033081 Exhibit 20, Letter, Bates Nos. Geller 140 033083 exhibit 21, Letter, Bates Nos. Geller 140 034109-10 Exhibit 22, Document entitled, "The New 141 Search Technology," Bates Nos. Geller 054521-28 Exhibit 23, E-mail dated 8/27/01, Bates 143 No. Brin 00000001 Exhibit 24, Letter dated 6/14/05 147 Exhibit 25, Documents Bates Nos. PA 152 0001419-1530

THE VIDEOGRAPHER: My name is Philip Glauberson of Veritex Corporate Services. The date today is August 19, 2009 and the time is approximately 9:47 a.m. This deposition is being held in the office of Stroock, Stroock and Lavan located at 767 Third Avenue, New York, New York. The caption of this case is PA Advisors LLC versus Google Inc., et al., in the United States District Court, Eastern District of Texas, Marshall Division, No. 2:07-CV-480-DF. The name of the witness is Ilya Geller. At this time the attorneys will identify themselves and the parties they represent, after which our court reporter, Joyce Silver of Veritex, will swear in the witness and we can proceed. MR. FENSTER: My name is Marc Fenster with Russ, August and Kabat on behalf of the Plaintiff nXn Technology, LLC, formally known as PA Advisors LLC, and for the witness. MR. PRIDHAM: David Pridham appearing today on behalf of nXn and Mr. Geller. MR. CANNON: My name is Brian Cannon. I'm with the Quinn Emanuel law firm. I represent

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ILYA GELLER oath that's given in court as if you were testifying in court. Do you understand that? A. I do. Q. And you are currently testifying in English and we have two translators here today. So if a problem arises with a question or an answer in English, we have translators that can help us. Okay? If you need a break at any point, please let me know. I understand you are -- you are ill, so I will try -- do my best to -- to move things along and accommodate that as best I can. I understand you're suffering from multiple sclerosis; is that correct? A. Yes, I do. Q. Will that illness affect your testimony today in any way? MR. FENSTER: Object to the form. A. I think yes. Q. How will it effect the testimony? A. I have MS. I have problems with my memory and I have problems with my thinking. Because you see this weather is very bad for me. It's exactly the weather -- the kind of weather that is bad for MS because with people with MS cannot -- you

1 2 also from the Quinn Emanuel firm. 3 MR. WHITE: My name is Jason White on 4 behalf of defendant Yahoo. 5 MARK BERELEKHIS and LENNY KUSHNER, Interpreters of 6 the Russian language, are duly sworn by the Notary: 7 I L Y A G E L L E R, residing at 2442 East 26th 8 Street, Brooklyn, New York 11235, having been duly 9 sworn by the Notary, testifies as follows: 10 DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. CANNON: 11 Q. Good morning -12 MR. FENSTER: Brian, excuse me one 13 second. Let me just make a statement for the record. 14 This notice -- this deposition was originally noticed 15 by plaintiff. It was cross-noticed by defendants, by 16 Google for defendants. We have agreed that 17 defendants will proceed first for three hours, that 18 they will have three hours to split for all 19 defendants; and that they will go first, and that 20 plaintiffs will take three hours to the extent the 21 witness is available -- able to go on after the 22 morning questioning, and that's how we will proceed 23 today; is that correct? 24 MR. CANNON: That is correct for today. 25
Google in this matter. With me is Eugene Novikov,

ILYA GELLER

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ILYA GELLER Obviously we understand the witness is ill and we will do what we need to do to accommodate his illness and make this as pain free as possible. To the extent we need additional time, we can work cooperatively with you to make that happen. MR. FENSTER: I have also advised that, while you're certainly free to -- we will discuss with you whether additional time is appropriate or possible after today. I have advised defendants they should regard the time they have today as if it's the time they will get with the witness and should proceed accordingly. MR. CANNON: Let's proceed. Q. Good morning, Mr. Geller. A. Good morning. Q. My name is Brian Cannon. I am an attorney for Google. I will be asking you a series of questions today. Have you ever been deposed before? A. Never. Q. This is the first time? A. Yes. Q. So I will be asking you a series of questions, and you've taken an oath which is the same

ILYA GELLER are looking all of you. All of you are looking at me. It's bad weather for me. It's very bad. I am bad in hot and humid weather. I am very bad, with my memory. Q. Are you taking any medications that might effect your testimony today? A. Yes. I take stem cells in Russia for MS, and actually with stem cells start to work a few weeks ago and it affects a lot -- it affects my health a lot. Q. Was -- does the stem cell treatment you referenced, affect your ability to provide testimony today? A. Nobody knows. I'm the only one who tries this kind of cure of treatment. No statistics -nobody knows. So I can't say for sure does or does not. My treatment influences my health condition, my ability to think and to remember things. Q. Mr. Geller, we're going to -- I'm going to be asking you questions today, and we are going to be looking at some documents. So I'm going to pass you the first document. It's -- it's already been marked as Exhibit 6 in this lawsuit and it is US Patent 6199067.

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ILYA GELLER the page that bears the label Etkin 000239. A. 002. Q. 239 are the final three digits. A. 239, right. Q. And let me know when you're there. Perfect. This is the results of a -- of an international search report, and my question to you is: Have you seen this -- do you have a memory of seeing this page back in the 2001-2000 time frame? A. This page, I don't remember. Perhaps I saw it, but he didn't -- I don't remember he said something specific about this. What is it? Q. Did you ever instruct Mr. Etkin not to pursue a European patent application, that you remember? A. Ah, yes, I paid a lot of money. I paid him a lot of money. He promised me -- he filed for Europe and he filed for Canada. He filed for Israel. It worth me something like $12,000 -- yes, or $18,000. I don't remember. I lost all this money. Right. Q. But you paid him to do that work? A. Uh-huh.

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ILYA GELLER Q. Good afternoon, Mr. Geller. I'd like to ask you a few questions. I understand that it's getting later in the day and you mentioned that you're getting tired. Can you tell us how you're feeling? A. Yes, I am tired a lot because, you see. Q. Are -- are you okay to answer questions for a little bit? A. Just a little, yes, a little bit, please. Q. Where did you grow up? A. Russia, Ulyanovsk, middle Russia. Q. And when did you immigrate to the United States? A. 12th of December, 1992. Q. When were you born, Mr. Geller? A. 4th of June, 1969. Q. 1969? A. Yes. Q. So you're about 23 years old when you immigrated; is that right? A. Yes, I am. Q. Did you -- so you did your early education in -- in Russia? A. Yes, I did.
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ILYA GELLER Q. What did you study in Russia? A. Civil engineering and also I study mainframe computer. Mainframe. Mainframe and civil engineering. A little bit. Q. Tell us a little bit about your education. I don't know how the education system works in Russia, so tell us a little bit about how the education system works from early school, elementary or grammar school on. A. I studied a lot of science. I studied mathematics, physics. I studied civil engineering, I studied different kinds of mechanics, whatever, because it was required in high school, but it was not the one -- it wasn't the education -- the -- the education I looked for because I -- because it didn't give me what I looked for. And actually I was in college for only four years because usually five years are required. At the end of my fourth year, I left the college and actually I didn't study anything else in Russia. It was '90 -- '94, '93, I don't remember exactly. Q. That was 1990 or 1991; is that right? A. Yes, I believe so, but I'm not sure. I'm not sure.

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ILYA GELLER Could you answer audibly? Yes, I -- I paid him. MR. CANNON: Let's take a short break. THE VIDEOGRAPHER: We are going off the record. The time is approximately 2:22 p.m. (Recess taken.) THE VIDEOGRAPHER: We're going on the record. The time is approximately 2:38 p.m. BY MR. CANNON: Q. Mr. Geller, I only have a few more minutes the three hours that I have today, and I would like to reserve whatever time I have left for potential cross-examination after counsel may ask you questions, but thank you for your time today. MR. FENSTER: You had to go on the record with that. All right. Why don't we go off the record and -- okay, let's go off the record and take a break. THE VIDEOGRAPHER: We are going off the record. The time is approximately 2:38 p.m. (Recess taken.) THE VIDEOGRAPHER: We're going on the record. The time is approximately 2:52 p.m. CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR. FENSTER: Q. A.

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ILYA GELLER Q. Where did you go to college in Russia? A. The same college in the same city Ulyanovsk Polytechnical Institute. Q. And tell me a little bit about your family. Your -- did you come from a big family? How many brothers and sisters did you have? A. I -- I have only one brother -- brother. The family is in Russian at the time. We are not big and my parents had only two children, me and my brother. My brother was a civil engineer and he -he continues the same career. He became estimator in the companies -- a company. I don't know which one. He became an estimator, he makes money, right. And my father, he was also a civil engineer. Civil engineer and he build factories, whatever. My mother was a teacher. She taught economy in college. Right. But finally we immigrated to this country and my brother, like I told you, continued his career and my mother become -- she's old and she became -- she got SSI and now she retires. Father died in here. Q. When did your father pass away? A. '97, September of '97. Q. And did your mother work when she came

ILYA GELLER camps and during the war. Yes. Q. What was it like for you growing up as a Jewish person in -- in Russia? A. Not pleasant, not pleasant at all because all the -- of anti-Semitism. And also I grew up in a small provincial town and it was awful. Because you see I had nothing to do. I am a creator. I have a spirit of creator. I -- yes, and it wasn't -- could I ask the translator? (Speaks Russian.) MR. BERELEKHIS: It was a very stifling atmosphere I grew up. A. Yes, definitely stifling atmosphere in this town. Right. And I decided -- finally I decided that I have nothing to find in Russia, especially after Perestroika, and I decided to escape to the United States because I had nothing in there. Q. What did you want to do when you came -why did you decide to come to the United States? A. I -- it's very strange, I know, especially it was strange for my parents and for all my relatives. I wanted to become a scientist and I -- I decided to start from philosophy because I studied precise sciences like math and physics for

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ILYA GELLER here? A. Yes, she did. Q. And what did she do? A. She was a teacher in college. Q. And tell me a little bit about your -your mother and father, if you can, sort of their background. A. Nothing special. My father was just a manager, civil engineer. He managed something called factory. Factories. He built factories and my mother, she was just a teacher. Nothing -- nothing extraordinary. Nothing -- nothing that special. Q. Were your parents survivors of the concentration camps? A. Yes, my mother was in a concentration camp but, fortunately for her, she survived. She was two years old and -- when it began and actually she lost a lot in the concentration camp. My father, he was more lucky than my mother. He was lucky -- luckier then my mother. He could escape Germans and spend what time in the part that wasn't occupied. So I was just -- my parents were lucky, yes, and -- but, actually, my parents' families were killed by Germans in concentration

ILYA GELLER many years, and -- but they didn't give me satisfaction, and I decided to try philosophy. So when I came to America, I tried to go -- to go to college and to study philosophy. Q. And did you go to college in America when you came here to study philosophy? A. Yes, I came to Brooklyn College and I studied philosophy in Brooklyn College till I could. Q. Until what? A. Till I could, until I can do it -- could do it. Q. And when did you start in college? You immigrated in 1992? A. '94. '94. Before I started another college I start computer science, I don't remember mostly mainframe. I don't remember the name of the college. I can't give you the dates -- dates, but I studied computer science for half of the year goes something like this. Q. Is it common or was it common in your experience for -- you mentioned that you studied precise sciences earlier? A. Uh-huh. Q. And that you spent many years doing that.

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ILYA GELLER Right? A. Yes, right. Q. And is it sort of a natural progression to study philosophy after that in your experience? MR. CANNON: Objection, leading. Q. Go ahead. A. I think, yes. Yes, because I didn't find anything what I looked for, I didn't find it. I couldn't find it in precise sciences. In math or physics or whatever, I couldn't find what -- or chemistry, I studied a lot of things because in Russia in college we teach you everything. I knew chemistry. I knew physics. I knew mathematics. I knew many other disciplines. If you want, I can tell you. Q. Did many of the other students or teachers of philosophy that you met and encountered during your study of philosophy, have such backgrounds in precise sciences? A. None. None at all. Nobody. Q. Do you have any understanding as to why that is? A. Yes, I do. Because -- because humanities, humanities are dead for the past 60

ILYA GELLER that idea before you? MR. CANNON: Objection, form. A. Because, first of all, computers -- our last great philosophers lived, let's say, 80 years ago, 70 years ago. And at that time, computers didn't exist, first of all. And, second, today all of them, except Wittgenstein, followers of Hegel, followers of Hegel and -- what -- and Google actually helped me to prove it, Google and Yahoo, because we did it and I couldn't -- I couldn't -- I didn't have money and I was ill, but they helped me to prove that Hegel was wrong. And also Russell and all his Vienna cycle are wrong. The computer didn't exist at that time. So in the -- like I told you, no money in philosophy, nobody came to philosophy. It happened this way. So nobody, I can say it for sure, absolutely. Q. Is it your belief that it was your background in philosophy that enabled you to transform Internet search? MR. CANNON: Objection, form, leading. A. Yes, it is. It's the only thing that helped me to come to the idea because

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ILYA GELLER years, 70, 80 years. Nothing new is going on in humanities. Psychology, philosophy, and people ambitions do not come to philosophy because you can't find money or honor in philosophy, nothing. Q. You mentioned earlier in your testimony that you had a feeling during this cab ride in 1998, August 1998, that you might be able to develop an idea to apply philosophy to Internet search; is that right? MR. CANNON: Objection to form and leading. MR. WHITE: If one of us objects, it is for both of us so I don't have to say it. MR. FENSTER: Certainly. A. Yes, it is. Q. And to your knowledge, are you the first to have the idea that you did about applying philosophy to Internet search? MR. CANNON: Objection to form. Leading. A. Absolutely. I know it for sure. Absolutely. I know, I know what happened in philosophy for the past 3,000 years and I know I'm the first. Q. So why do you think that no one came to

ILYA GELLER personalization, I couldn't come to the idea -- how many thousands, tens of thousands of very good paid scientists in the world and none of them could do -could come to the idea of personalization, nobody. It's practically impossible. Q. You testified earlier that you tried to commercialize your invention; is that right? A. All the time. All of the time. Q. And you mentioned some of the things that you did to try to commercialize that. I would like to show you some documents and ask you a few questions about that with respect to your efforts to commercialize. A. Uh-huh. MR. FENSTER: Do you know the next in order that we are up to? MR. CANNON: 18, it is. MR. FENSTER: I would like to ask the court reporter to mark as the next exhibit a document bearing Bates Nos. Geller 31979 through 319881. (Exhibit 18, Letter, Bates Nos. Geller 031979-91 is received and marked for identification.) Q. Mr. Geller, do you recognize Exhibit 18? A. I think yes, I do. Yes.

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ILYA GELLER Search Technology," Bates Nos. Geller 054521-28 is received and marked for identification.) Q. Mr. Geller, I -- I know it's getting late in the day, but I need you to wait for a question and just respond to the questions. Okay? A. Uh-huh. Q. I'll try to wrap up as soon as I can. Do you recognize Exhibit 22? A. Yes, I do. Q. What is it? A. It's an exception from my business plan exception. MR. BERELEKHIS: Excerpt. A. Excerpt, right. Q. It's an excerpt from your business plan? A. Yes, it is. Q. And it's entitled, or it says at the top, "White Paper." A. It is. Q. What does that mean? A. It means that I look for money, and people that wrote the business plan for me, they're people that wrote the business plan for me said that I could put this on my site for people who would

ILYA GELLER Brin. Q. So earlier, defendant's counsel was asking you about -- about communications with Mr. Brin or with Google and you referred to an E-mail from 2001. Do you recall that testimony? MR. CANNON: Objection, form. Misstates the testimony. A. Yes, I do. Q. Is this the E-mail that you were referring to? A. Yes -MR. CANNON: Objection to form. Leading. Q. Go ahead. A. Yes, I did. Q. Did you prepare this E-mail? MR. CANNON: Objection, form, leading. A. Yes, I did. Q. Did you send it? A. Yes, I did. Q. To whom did you send it? A. Sergey Brin. Q. When did you send it? A. 27th of July, 2001. Q. Why did you send it?

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ILYA GELLER come. I don't remember which site is it. Is it -could be -- ah, LexiClone. So I already have -- had LexiClone. LexiClone already existed, so I put it at LexiClone site so people come to my site could read it and invest money with me. Q. This -- this document was posted on lexiclone.com? A. Yes. Q. And do you know approximately when it was posted on lexiclone.com? A. I have no -- honestly, I don't remember, but it was posted some -- between, let's say, 2005, somewhere in 2004. MR. FENSTER: I will ask the court reporter to mark as Exhibit 23, a document bearing Bates numbers Brin, B-r-i-n 1. (Exhibit 23, E-mail dated 8/27/01, Bates No. Brin 00000001 is received and marked for identification.) A. Yes, I already saw this document. Q. Do you recognize Exhibit 23? A. Yes. Q. What is it? A. It's a letter to Sergey Brin, Sergey

ILYA GELLER A. I wanted -- I told you, I saw that Google is very ambitious company -- actually, I liked -- I liked Google. I liked Google and I liked what they did and how they did and I put to communicate to incorporate in Google somehow. I thought we would buy license, we will combine our efforts because I saw what Ser- -- Sergey Brin went in my direction, went to personalization and went to all this stuff. I just saw that they are so bright, I knew I couldn't conduct Yahoo because Yahoo is not a company with -Yahoo is not a company with -- is very -- could I say to you in Russian? (Speaks Russian.) MR. BERELEKHIS: Yahoo is not a very prospective company, promising. A. Promising. Promising. Promising company and I decided to -- I tried to conduct Google. Right. I -- I thought Sergey -- I told you, I -Sergey, he speaks Russian and at that time I afraid I couldn't speak English at all and even my memory was compromised -- was compromised and -- uh-huh. MR. WHITE: Objection, non-responsive. Q. Mr. Geller, you mentioned this morning and just now a few times that in maybe the early

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ILYA GELLER 2000s you couldn't speak English? A. Yes. Q. Was your English less good than it is now? MR. CANNON: Objection, form, leading. A. A lot. Q. Why? A. MS, multiple sclerosis. It's one of -(Speaks Russian.) MR. BERELEKHIS: Consequences. A. Consequences of the multiple sclerosis. It's one of the strongest -- people can speak -- with multiple sclerosis we can speak foreign languages and you see if I could, it means that -- if not multiple sclerosis, English would be -- my English would be perfect. Q. Was your English -- strike that. Did your English deterio -- deteriorate as a result of MS? MR. CANNON: Objection, leading, form. A. (Speaks Russian.) A lot. MR. FENSTER: Let me ask the court reporter to mark Exhibit 24, a document that has been

ILYA GELLER response to this letter? A. No, no. MR. CANNON: Objection, form, to the preceding question. Q. Why didn't -- why didn't you sue Google when you didn't get a response in 2005? A. First of all, I didn't think about suing Google. Actually, I wanted to do business. Listen, it's waste of time -- I'm sorry, you are lawyers, I'm very sorry but listen, I didn't think to sue somebody. I thought how to develop the business. I -- because business brings much more money, it does something. Suing somebody, sorry, you're lawyers, I'm sorry, is no good. Is no good at all. Suing someone, I didn't thought to sue somebody. I didn't think to sue Google. I thought to sell the license and to -- to build the business. Q. And why didn't you build the business with Google? MR. CANNON: Objection to the form. A. Google didn't respond and at -- at that time I began to travel to Russia and it was -- you see this treatment that I got in Russia is a tricky one. I mean when -- when I had this treatment I

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ILYA GELLER produced as Bates No. Geller 057383, a letter dated June 14, 2005 from Joseph Diamante to David Drummond, D-r-u-m-m-o-n-d, at Google. MR. CANNON: I will just lodge an objection on the record to this document. I understand this was produced just -- just yesterday and we haven't had a chance to look at it. (Exhibit 24, Letter dated 6/14/05 is received and marked for identification.) A. Yes, I recognize this document. Q. What is this document? A. I tried to license my -- to license my technology to Google because I saw Google begin to use my technology to -- to full scale. I mean Google began this. Edward started with -- Edward and Google started personalization. And I -- is it privilege? Could I say what I hired the lawyer? Q. Not the fact that you hired him, but any communications, you shouldn't reveal any communications that you had with counsel. A. Right. And Joseph Diamante sent this letter for -- for me because I thought Google would be interested to license my technology. Q. And to your knowledge, was there a

ILYA GELLER couldn't think about anything because you see before that I was in bad condition. It was awful. I -I -- I felt very bad. I could work only one or two hours per day. And after I went to Russia, it was like I came from prison, from prison for life. You see, I just began to breathe. I began to think. I -- sorry, I just couldn't think about anything at that time. Q. Let me ask you to take a look quickly at the patent purchase agreement which was marked earlier as Exhibit 16. A. Uh-huh. Q. So in 2007, you sold your patent to PA Advisors; is that right? A. Yes, I did. Q. And why did you do that? A. First of all, I saw people from PA Advisors. I saw -- I met Dave. I met Eric. I saw what these are very competent people and they understand the stuff. And I knew with my patent will be in good hands. It won't lie as a dead burden. And secondly, I needed money to continue coming to Russia because at that time I didn't have any. I didn't have money.

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ILYA GELLER Q. What did you need the money for? A. For Russian, because the treatment in Russia is astronomically expensive. It's outrageously expensive. Right. It's so expensive. Q. And you didn't have money to pay for the treatment? A. No, not at all. I had only Social Security and disability and my annual income from social security by disability is enough only for -for two -- my social security by disability for two years is enough to come to Russia once, so I didn't have any money. I didn't have any money. I couldn't get money from anywhere because I couldn't go even to work because, listen, I was -- I was a long time. So the patent was the only commodity what I could sell. Q. And what do you think would have happened to you if you didn't get -THE VIDEOGRAPHER: I'm sorry, we need to change tape. This will end videotape number three of the deposition of Ilya Geller. We are going off the record at approximately 3:37 p.m., August 19, 2009. (A discussion is held off the record.) THE VIDEOGRAPHER: We are now on the record, beginning approximately 3:45 p.m., August 19,

ILYA GELLER documents bearing Bates Nos. PA 1419 through 1530. (Exhibit 25, Documents Bates Nos. PA 0001419-1530 is received and marked for identification.) Q. Mr. Geller, could you look through Exhibit 25 and tell me if you recognize it. A. I recognize page number one of one. It's Unisearch my site before LexiClone came. It's Unisearch. Q. Are those printouts of the Unisearch -do you recognize these as printouts of your website unisearch.net at various points in time? MR. CANNON: Objection, leading. Form. A. Yes, these unisearch.net. Searched on the Internet. Q. And do you recognize this? Do they look like accurate copies of your website? MR. CANNON: Objection, form. A. I'm not quite sure because a lot of time passed away -- passed away but I think, yes, because I have this Internet search. I remember. Search on the Internet trial version. And also I remember this presentation of the Unisearch, right. Yes. And I remember this article. It's in Russian. Right.

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ILYA GELLER 2009. This will begin videotape number four of the deposition of Ilya Geller. BY MR. FENSTER: Q. Mr. Geller, referring back to Exhibit 16, the patent purchase agreement, Google's counsel referred you to Section 2.2? A. Uh-huh. Q. Do you see that? A. Uh-huh. Q. What's your understanding of that provision? A. Actually, I rely on my legal counsel. He did everything. Q. Do you understand that you're entitled to a portion of any proceeds that are generated, either from this lawsuit or from your patents? MR. CANNON: Objection, leading. A. Yes, I do. Q. Did you have any other way to monetize your patents when you sold it? MR. CANNON: Objection, leading. A. No. MR. FENSTER: Let me ask the court reporter to mark as Exhibit 25, a collection of

ILYA GELLER It's my old Unisearch. Q. I'll represent to you, Mr. Geller, that these are printouts from the way back machine which is an Internet archive. Looking, for example, at the second page which is PA 1420, do you see that? A. 1420, yes, I do. Q. Does this look to be a copy of your website as it existed on November 28, 1999? And I'm referring to the date that's listed in the url at the bottom of the page? MR. CANNON: Objection, leading. A. Excuse me, I'm confused. Which date, this -- this one (indicating). Q. I am referring you to the url at the bottom which is http? A. This one. Uh-huh. Yes, exactly. Yes, it is. Yes. MR. FENSTER: Brian, as I mentioned during the break, the witness informed me that he's not feeling well and would like to adjourn soon. So I'm going to have to reserve my time. I had about 50 minutes by my count or so. But out of respect for the -- the witness' request and your request to do another five minutes, I'm going to adjourn now and

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ILYA GELLER reserve my time for if and when the deposition is continued. MR. CANNON: Understood. REDIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. CANNON: Q. Mr. Geller, counsel showed you a number of exhibits that appeared to reflect correspondence that you had either written or prepared to send out to people, potential investors or potential purchasers. Do you remember that -- those exhibits that we looked at, the correspondence? An example of which -A. Do you mean this one (indicating)? Q. No, prior to that. Exhibit -A. This one (indicating). Q. 21, yes, Exhibit 23, 21, Exhibit 18, a number of the correspondents. A. Yes. Q. Do you recall the time frame that -in -- in which you sent out that correspondence? MR. FENSTER: Object to form. A. A few years, a few years. Many years. Many years. I believe I -- I began to send these letters as soon as my -- my program was ready and we decide unisearch.net was ready. I began to send it

ILYA GELLER We are going off the record at approximately 3:54 p.m., August 19, 2009. (Adjourned.) JURAT I, ILYA GELLER, the witness herein, having read the foregoing testimony of the pages of this deposition, do certify it to be a true and correct transcript, subject to the corrections, if any, shown on the attached pages.

ILYA GELLER Dated:

sworn and subscribed before me on this day of , 2009. Notary Public of the State of My commission expires on: ____ .

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ILYA GELLER and not only these letters. I believe much more letters. I sent thousands of letters. I sent them thousands of places. Q. And over what period of time did you send those letters? A. Many years, for many years. I sent these letters for many, many years. MR. CANNON: I have no further questions at this time. And I appreciate working with counsel to schedule a follow-up deposition, if we can. MR. FENSTER: In light of -- many of the documents that were marked have been designated as attorneys eyes only by both sides or by various parties, so I propose -- let's provisionally mark the deposition as attorney's eyes only subject to review and designation upon review of the transcript. MR. CANNON: Okay, let's -- let's do that. I think only portions of it relate to attorneys eyes only, but that's after the fact we will figure that out. MR. FENSTER: I agree. THE VIDEOGRAPHER: This will end videotape number four of the deposition of Ilya Geller and conclude the recording of this deposition.

ILYA GELLER ERRATA STATE OF NEW YORK ) ) ss: COUNTY OF NEW YORK ) I wish to make the following changes, for the following reasons: PAGE LINE ____ ____ CHANGE:____________________________ REASON:____________________________ ____ ____ CHANGE:____________________________ REASON:____________________________ ____ ____ CHANGE:____________________________ REASON:____________________________ ____ ____ CHANGE:____________________________ REASON:____________________________ ____ ____ CHANGE:____________________________ REASON:____________________________ ____ ____ CHANGE:____________________________ REASON:____________________________ ____ ____ CHANGE:____________________________ REASON:____________________________ _______________________________ __________ WITNESS' SIGNATURE DATE

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