Witt v. Department of the Air Force et al

Filing 131

RESPONSE, by Defendants Department of the Air Force, Donald H Rumsfeld, Mary L Walker, Michael W Wynne, to 102 MOTION for Summary Judgment and Memorandum in Support of Motion. Oral Argument Requested. (Attachments: # 1 Exhibit)(Phipps, Peter)

Witt v. Department of the Air Force et al

Doc. 131 Att. 1

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Judge Ronald B. Leighton

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT WESTERN DISTRICT OF WASHINGTON AT TACOMA MAJOR MARGARET WITT ) ) ) ) ) ) ) ) ) ) ) ) ) )

11

Plaintiff,
12

No. C06-5195 RBL DEFENDANTS' EXHIBITS IN OPPOSITION TO PLAINTIFF'S MOTION FOR SUMMARY JUDGMENT

v.
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UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF THE AIR FORCE, et al. Defendants.

EXHIBIT Ltr. Plaintiff's Responses to Defendants' First Set of Interrogatories and Requests For Admission .. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . A Deposition of Elizabeth Kier. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . B Deposition of Margaret Witt. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . C Deposition of Dennis Laich. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . D Deposition of Nathaniel Frank.. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . E Defendants' Supplemental Response to Plaintiff's Interrogatory 12(d). . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . F Deposition of Charles Stenner. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . G Deposition of Eric Crabtree. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . H Declaration of Eric Crabtree. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . I Deposition of Anthony Greenwald. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . J Deposition of Leah Crawford. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . K Deposition of Stacey Julian... . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . L Deposition of Jill Robinson. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . M Deposition of Kenneth Winslow. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . N Deposition of Edmond Hrivnak. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . O

( C 0 6 -5 1 9 5 ) DEFENDANTS' EXHIBITS IN OPPOSITION TO PLAINTIFF'S MOTION FOR SUMMARY JUDGMENT

U N I T E D STATES D E P A R T M E N T O F JU S T I C E C I V I L D I V I S I O N , FED E R A L PR O G R A M S BR A N C H P . O . BOX 883, BEN FRANKLIN STATION W A S H IN G T O N , D . C . 20044 ( 2 0 2 ) 616-8482

Dockets.Justia.com

EXHIBIT A
Plaintiff's Responses to Defendants' First Set of Interrogatories and Requests for Admission

EXHIBIT B
Deposition of Elizabeth Kier

1

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT WESTERN DISTRICT OF WASHINGTON AT TACOMA ___________________________________________________________ MAJOR MARGARET WITT, ) ) Plaintiff, ) ) vs. ) C065195RBL ) UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF ) THE AIR FORCE; COLONEL MARY L.) WALKER, Commander 446th ) Aeromedical Evacuation ) Squadron, McChord Air Force ) Base; and JAMES G. ROCHE, ) SECRETARY, DEPARTMENT OF THE ) AIR FORCE, ) ) Defendants. ) ___________________________________________________________ DEPOSITION UPON ORAL EXAMINATION OF ELIZABETH KIER ___________________________________________________________ APPEARANCES: FOR THE PLAINTIFF: JAMES E. LOBSENZ CARNEY, BADLEY, SPELLMAN 701 FIFTH AVENUE, SUITE 3600 SEATTLE, WASHINGTON 98104 STEPHEN J. BUCKINGHAM U.S. DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE 20 MASSACHUSETTS AVENUE NW WASHINGTON, DC 20044 MAY 20, 2010

FOR THE DEFENDANTS:

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is that right? A Q Yep. And then the journal published a letter that you wrote -A Q A Q Yes. -- responding to those two? Exactly. And it's the article entitled Homosexuals in the U.S. Military: A Q Yes. In a general sense can you tell me what opinion you're offering in this case? A I'm offering my professional opinion on the justification for the Don't Ask/Don't Tell policy. Q A And what is that opinion? That the policy doesn't have any basis in social science or history, any justification. Q A Q Are there any other opinions you're offering? No. Are you offering any opinion regarding the application of the Don't Ask/Don't Tell policy as it was applied specifically to Margaret Witt? A Q No. Are you offering any opinion about whether the specific discharge of Margaret Witt under the Don't Ask/Don't Open Integration and Combat Effectiveness?

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Tell policy had some effect on her unit's morale and cohesion? A Q No. Are you offering any opinion as to whether the specific discharge of Margaret Witt was necessary to promote unit morale and cohesion? A Q No. I'm just going to ask you just a few background questions about your expertise. expert in? A Q A Q A Q Political science. Any other fields? International relations and civil military relations. Anything else? No. And what was the second field you said international relations and...? A Q A Civil military relations or international security. Are those all kind of one general academic area? They're separate. Some people will specialize within What field are you an

civil military relations. Q Is international security a subsection of civil military relations? A I'm just trying to figure out how it does --

-- Civil military relations is a subset of international security if you do international relations, but if do

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then here you quoted, "The presence in the armed forces of persons who demonstrated a propensity or intent to engage in homosexual acts would create an unacceptable risk to the high standards of morale, good order and discipline and unit cohesion that are the essence of military capability." And you cite 10 USC 654 for that

proposition; is that right? A Q Yes. Is it your understanding that 10 USC 654 -- What is that citation? A I assume it's the Don't Ask/Don't Tell policy; it's the formal lettering for the Don't Ask/Don't Tell policy. Q And is it your understanding that that was a law that Congress passed? A Q Yes. And do you know whether or not 10 USC 654 makes other findings that are not mentioned in Paragraph 8? A Q I've never read through it, no. Okay. I'm going to show you yet another exhibit. This

one we'll mark as Exhibit 3. (Exhibit Number 3 marked.) Q A Q Do you recognize this document? No. I've never looked at the original.

I guess let me ask you this question; if we go back, if we go away from Exhibit 3 now and go back to Paragraph 8

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you say, "Despite an enormous amount of research on military and non-military groups, scholars do not even concur that there is a correlation between cohesion and performance." to there? A Q A Primary group cohesion. Inclusive of both social cohesion and task cohesion? Yes. And if you -- But there is much -- There's What type of cohesion are you referring

somewhat of an agreement of a consensus of this relationship, correlation between task cohesion and performance. Q A Q And performance, is that what you said? Yes. Is it fair to say that some -- I'm going back to the sentence where you say scholars do not even concur that there is a correlation. Is it fair to say that some

scholars believe there's no correlation between cohesion and performance; is that accurate? A Q Prob-- Yes. I don't know. I don't know.

Have any researchers found positive links between social cohesion and performance or military techniques?

A Q A Q

And "positive link" you mean...? A positive correlation. Correlation? Yes.

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A Q

Yes. So, is it fair to say that some social science research indicates that social performance -- social cohesion and military effectiveness are positively correlated?

A Q A

I know of one study. What study is that? It's a joint authored by Beal, B-E-A-L. 2002. I think it's

And I don't know all the authors' names.

Q

Do you recall the findings, what that study found if you were to sum it up in a sentence or two?

A

It, it found that there was an independent effect in the sense of a correlation between task cohesion and performance, between social cohesion and performance and between group pride and performance, and performance measured in terms of process not outcome.

Q

And I imagine that group pride would probably be the same size group as, as the social cohesion and task cohesion?

A Q

Yes. Can I refer you back to Exhibit 2 which is your article. And I'd like to, to go to Page 11 of that article. Here you have a section of your article that's subtitled Unit Cohesion and Military Effectiveness. where I am? Do you see

A

Yes.

EXHIBIT C
Deposition of Margaret Witt

Margaret Witt

May 24, 2010 Page 1

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT WESTERN DISTRICT OF WASHINGTON AT TACOMA M A J O R MARGARET WITT, Plaintiff, v. U N I T E D STATES DEPARTMENT OF T H E AIR FORCE, et al., Defendants. _______________________________________________________ DEPOSITION OF MAJOR MARGARET WITT Monday, May 24, 2010 Pages 1 to 136 _______________________________________________________ NO. C06-5195 RBL

Jody K. Pope CCR/RPR SNOVER REALTIME REPORTING Professional Court Reporters 522 W. Riverside Avenue, Suite #560 Spokane, Washington 99210 [phone] Fax [phone] E-mail: snoverrealtime.net LIC. NO. WA 3114 / LIC. NO. ID 939

SNOVER REALTIME REPORTING (509) 467 - 0666

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Margaret Witt

May 24, 2010 Page 46

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S p o k a n e and while you were an officer in the Air Force? A. I don't recall whether I told them I was an

officer. MR. LOBSENZ: recall. A. Don't speculate if you don't

The question is, do you recall. I don't recall.

B Y MR. PHIPPS: Q. Okay. From your understanding of the term

" o f f i c e r s h i p , " are extramarital sexual relationships c o n s i s t e n t with that concept? A. Q. A. Q. Officership? Yeah. No. So I'm interested in looking at your non-military So from high school on -Excuse me, Peter. I'm just

e m p l o y m e n t background. MS. LOBSENZ: asking.

It sounds like you're going into a different

s u b j e c t , and we've been going for about an hour. MR. PHIPPS: Oh, yeah. If you want to take

a break, we can take a break.

We can go off the record.

(A break was taken.) B Y MR. PHIPPS: Q. I think where I want to go here is just to touch Probably the

b a s e on your nonmilitary employment.

e a s i e s t way to start on this is maybe to just have you

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Margaret Witt

May 24, 2010 Page 72

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B Y MR. PHIPPS: Q. And the question here is how many members of the Again, it's a how

m i l i t a r y have you been attracted to.

m a n y question, not a who question, by name. A. Q. Four. Were any of those members at McChord while you

w e r e at McChord? A. Q. No. Of those four, how many of them were male and how

m a n y of them were female? A. Q. A. Q. Two. Two each? Yes. Have you ever engaged in homosexual acts with any And I don't want names.

o t h e r member of the military? A. Q. A. Q. Yes. How many persons? Two.

And roughly when was that?

Roughly when were

t h o s e instances when you engaged in other sexual acts w i t h other members of the military? A. Q. A. Q. Between the years of '88 and '95. Were those persons officers or enlisted? Yes. Well, okay. Were they officers?

SNOVER REALTIME REPORTING (509) 467 - 0666

f3120836-ebe2-46d4-a6dc-fda100dfffd7

Margaret Witt

May 24, 2010 Page 73

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A. Q. A. Q. A. Q. A. Q. A. Q. A. Q. A. Q. A. Q. A. Q.

Yes. They were both officers? Yes. Did you ever work for either one of them? No, I did not. Did either of them work for you? No, they did not. What branch of service were they in? Air Force. Did you ever live with either of those persons? Yes, I did. Okay. Did you live with both of those persons?

No, I did not. You lived with one of them? That was a statement. Question mark. Yes. Have you ever engaged in homosexual acts with any Did you live with one of them?

c i v i l i a n employees or contract employees of the D e p a r t m e n t of Defense or any branch of military service? A. Q. No. Did you ever tell any member of the 446 Wing that

y o u were gay or lesbian or words to that effect? MR. LOBSENZ: Well, that makes me more

i n c l i n e d to object to the form because of "words to that

SNOVER REALTIME REPORTING (509) 467 - 0666

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Margaret Witt

May 24, 2010 Page 124

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Q. A. Q.

Under twenty? Under twenty.

Under fifteen?

In addition to those people, did you contact

a n y o n e else to see if they would provide any statement i n support of your discharge or your litigation or your c a s e generally? A. Q. A. Yes. Roughly how many people did you contact? Less than five. There were people that have

s a i d , if you ever need anything, let me know. Q. So you're taking them up on their offer

essentially? A. Q. Yes. Did you ever tell anyone who was providing a

s w o r n statement for you or any statement for you, the r e a s o n s that you understood the Air Force was i n v e s t i g a t i n g you for homosexual conduct? A. Q. I don't recall. Well, I will ask this more specifically. Before

a n y of these people provided a sworn statement or any s t a t e m e n t on your behalf, did you ever tell them or e x p l a i n to them the specific reasons that you understood t h e Air Force was investigating you for homosexual conduct? A. I think someone told me.

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Margaret Witt

May 24, 2010 Page 125

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Q. A.

And what did they tell you? They said -- I can't remember specific. I can't

r e m e m b e r specific things. Q. A. Did they say that they -They said I heard that, you know, I know why or I

h e a r d why. Q. Okay. So you can't recall the specifics of what

t h e y said or that they didn't reveal specifics of what t h e y knew? A. Q. I can't recall specifics. Did you tell anyone who provided statements for

y o u r discharge or for your litigation the instances of h o m o s e x u a l acts that you engaged in? A. Q. No. Did you tell anyone who provided sworn statements

f o r you as to why you would want a sworn statement from t h e m or why it would be in your interest to receive a s w o r n statement from them? A. Q. A. Q. Yes. Who did you speak with about that? I don't know exactly who. Well, what did you say? MR. LOBSENZ: A. Go ahead. Go ahead.

Well, I recall generally that they would ask what

w a s needed and I would say speak to -- speak to what you

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EXHIBIT D
Deposition of Dennis Laich

EXHIBIT E
Deposition of Nathaniel Frank

1

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT WESTERN DISTRICT OF WASHINGTON AT TACOMA MAJOR MARGARET WITT, Plaintiff, -againstUNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF THE AIR FORCE, et al., Defendants. -------------------------------) ) ) ) ) ) ) ) ) )

No. C06-5195 RBL

DEPOSITION of NATHANIEL FRANK, Ph.D., an Expert Witness, taken by Defendants at the offices of The ACLU, 125 Broad Street, 18th Floor, New York, New York, on Friday, May 14, 2010, commencing at 10 a.m., before Charleane M. Heading, a Registered Merit Reporter and Notary Public within and for the State of New York.

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Frank In addition, in some examples, for instance, where it was perceived that there were witch hunts, that fear in and of itself and the concern about being forced to, fear of inquiry, investigation, discharge, fear of harassment and violence and concern that people may be forced to tell on their friends about things is not good for the unit. Q So do you think if certain unit

members are placed in a position where they may have to, quote, "tell on their friends," that's adverse to furthering unit cohesion and morale? A I think the fear of having to do

that could be adverse to morale in the unit. Q Now, on this last section that

you've, on this section IX, you say, "Many of Major Witt's unit mates say they have long believed she is a lesbian." When you say many, is this bounded by the number of declarations that you've read? A Yes, it is, although some of the

people in those declarations said that they believed many other people knew so that also informs the word "many."
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EXHIBIT F
Defendants Supplementary Response to Plaintiff's Interrogatory 12 (d)

EXHIBIT G
Deposition of Charles Stenner

Deposition of Lt. Gen. Charles Edwin Stenner, Jr. 5-17-10 Page 1 U.S. DISTRICT COURT WESTERN DISTRICT OF WASHINGTON AT TACOMA

MAJOR MARGARET WITT, Plaintiff, vs UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF THE AIR FORCE; DONALD H. RUMSFELD, Secretary of Defense; MICHAEL W. WYNNE, Secretary of the Department of Air Force; and COLONEL MARY L. WALKER, Commander, 446th Aeromedical Evacuation Squadron, McChord AFB, Defendants. _____________________________________/ FILE NO. C06-5195 RBL

DEPOSITION OF LIEUTENANT GENERAL CHARLES EDWIN STENNER, JR. Monday, May 17, 2010 8:50 a.m. Taken by counsel for the Plaintiff at: Robins Air Force Base Warner Robins, Georgia

Stenographically Reported By: Gaye D. Traynor Certified Court Reporter-B2209 State of Georgia
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Deposition of Lt. Gen. Charles Edwin Stenner, Jr. 5-17-10 Page 73 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A necessarily result in no gay or lesbian members serving openly? MR. PHIPPS: Objection: Vague, calls for

legal conclusion, calls for speculation. THE WITNESS: uniformly degrades. A policy that's not applied A policy that is applied uniformly

sustains unit cohesion, good order and discipline and ultimately readiness for the war fighter. BY MS. DUNNE: Q Do you understand what I mean when I say the So gay or lesbian service members

term "serve openly." serving openly.

Do you understand when I use that term? Objection: Vague.

MR. PHIPPS:

(No response.)

BY MS. DUNNE: Q What -- how would you define a service member

who is gay or lesbian, i.e., engages in acts with a member of the same sex but they are serving in their unit and everyone knows of their sexual orientation? phrase you would use because I'm using... A The other option is for you to define what you So I'm -- because... What's the

mean by openly gay. Q

So, sir, when I say openly gay and lesbian,

that means somebody who's serving within their unit that other unit members and the Commander know they're gay or

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EXHIBIT H
Deposition of Eric Crabtree

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UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT WESTERN DISTRICT OF WASHINGTON AT TACOMA MARGARET WITT, Major, ) ) Plaintiff, ) ) v. ) ) UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF THE ) AIR FORCE; ROBERT M. GATES, ) Secretary of Defense; MICHAEL B. ) DONLEY, Secretary of Department ) of the Air Force, Colonel; ) JANETTE L. MOORE-HARBERT, ) Commander of the 446th ) Aeromedical Evacuation Squadron, ) Colonel; McChord AFB, ) ) Defendants. ) _________________________________)

NO. C06-5195-RBL

Deposition of MAJOR GENERAL ERIC W. CRABTREE, taken on behalf of Plaintiff, at 2040 Main Street, Suite 250, Irvine, California, commencing at the hour of 1:12 p.m., ending at 2:31 p.m., on Wednesday, March 24, 2010, before MICHELLE LOTT-MEYERHOFER, CSR 8226

2
Major General Eric W. Crabtree

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 no.

A Q

No. This might trigger a memory or it might not. Is

it possible that you knew, before the Summer of 2004, that there is this Major who's on the Promotional Recruitment Literature for a career in the Air Force Nursing Corp. that features her photograph? anything you every knew? A Q No, not until after the action started. So what is the first thing you ever found out Is that

about Major Margaret Witt? MR. DIEDERICH: Objection. Let me just caution

the General to the extent it's a conversation you had with an attorney about the case. answer is. I don't know what the

I just want to caution him to be careful That's all.

about conversations with an attorney. MR. LOBSENZ: Q Okay.

Well, why don't you answer this question yes or

Is the very first thing you ever found out about

Major Witt something you learned from an attorney? A Q A No. Okay. It was from, actually, headquarters. So what did you find out at that time?

I was told that -- I received notification that

a complaint had been filed through the chief of staff of the Air Force's Office alleging that Major Witt was involved with a woman in the Spokane area. And I was

14
Major General Eric W. Crabtree

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25

directed to do an investigation to find out if the allegations were true. Q Who is it that directed you to do an

investigation? A It was a letter from the Air Force Reserve

Command Headquarters. Q A Q Air Force Reserve Command is in Robins? Yes, Robins Air Force Base. So it's the Commander of Air Force Base Robins

that's sending you this directive? A It actually -- I'm thinking it came through the

Judge Advocate's Office there. Q order? A I don't know. If I had a copy of the letter, I So is there a name? Who is actually giving the

could tell you. that time. Q A Q Reserve? A Q Yes.

But I don't know exactly who it was at

But it's someone at Robins? Yes. Who is, at that time, Commander of Air Force

So if we just figured out who the Commander was

of Air Force Reserve in the Summer of 2004, that would be the person probably?

15
Major General Eric W. Crabtree

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25

A Q A

Yes. Would that be sent to you by e-mail? Not normally. Normally, it would come by

regular mail or electronically as an attachment to an e-mail? Q Okay. And do you know what the attachments were

that you got? A Q No, I don't. Do you know when you would have received these

instructions from General Sherrard? MR. DIEDERICH: THE WITNESS: date. BY MR. LOBSENZ: Q I'll show you these documents in a moment, but Objection. Form.

No, I don't know the specific

there are orders from Major General Duignan to you that are dated July 7th of 2004. Are you able to say anything

about approximate periods of time so that you can go backwards from when you got the orders from Duignan that you can say it must have been about a week or about a month or about five months that I got these orders from Sherrard? time? MR. DIEDERICH: THE WITNESS: Objection to form. It would Can you say anything about that period of

No, I really don't know.

25
Major General Eric W. Crabtree

EXHIBIT I
Declaration of Eric Crabtree

EXHIBIT J
Deposition of Anthony Greenwald

1

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT WESTERN DISTRICT OF WASHINGTON AT TACOMA ____________________________________________________________ MAJOR MARGARET WITT, ) ) Plaintiff, ) ) VS ) ) UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF THE ) AIR FORCE; COLONEL MARY L. ) WALKER, COMMANDER, 446TH ) AEROMEDICAL EVACUATION SQUADRON, ) McCHORD AIR FORCE BASE; and ) JAMES O. ROCHE, SECRETARY, ) DEPARTMENT OF THE AIR FORCE, ) ) Defendants, ) ____________________________________________________________ DEPOSITION OF ANTHONY GREENWALD, Ph.D. ____________________________________________________________

May 21, 2010

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mind. Q Okay. Do you know the type of unit that the 446th

Aeromedical Evacuation Squadron is? A Q Not in any detail. Do you know the type of work -- just to shorten this, because it's very long to say, I'm going to say the 446th AES. out. It will probably save us 15 minutes of spelling it Do you know the type of duties that the 446th AES

performs? A Aeromedical Evacuation. And I saw some incidental

references to the specifics of this in the declarations that I read. So to the extent that I have any detail

that's specific to the 446th, it would come from the content of those declarations in which there were mentions of some specific activities done by that unit. Q A Do you know if the 446th AES deploys in combat missions? I believe they do. But this is not something that I have

specific knowledge of. Q A Have you ever studied the military organization before? I have never done research in which the subjects were members of a military organization. Q A Q A So is that a no? It's almost a no. Okay. I want to know about the "almost," I suppose.

I did supervise the research of an Army lieutenant who was

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independently and before I undertook to do this report. Q It's true, isn't it, that some people are better at interpreting the information you're discussing than others; is that right? A I would say that's almost certainly true. don't know of studies explicitly of this. But I actually But it's quite

likely that the data from existing studies could be analyzed to show that. Q And it's possible that someone could reach an inference and not actually know that someone is gay; right? A Q Yes. That was my point.

So when you say that people were informally aware, does it mean that they drew an inference but didn't necessarily know?

A

I would not use the language that way.

If you draw an

inference, you do know in the way that I think about this. I think you're making a distinction between assuming the truth of something and knowing on the basis of factual evidence that it is true. knowing. Q I don't mean to take this into an epistemological digression. But I think that's where we're headed. Let's But both of those are forms of

back up a second.

It's true that someone can reach an

inference and be wrong; right? A Correct.

EXHIBIT K
Deposition of Leah Crawford

1

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT WESTERN DISTRICT OF WASHINGTON AT TACOMA ___________________________________________________________ MAJOR MARGARET WITT, ) ) Plaintiff, ) ) vs. ) C065195RBL ) UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF ) THE AIR FORCE; COLONEL MARY L.) WALKER, Commander 446th ) Aeromedical Evacuation ) Squadron, McChord Air Force ) Base; and JAMES G. ROCHE, ) SECRETARY, DEPARTMENT OF THE ) AIR FORCE, ) ) Defendants. ) ___________________________________________________________ DEPOSITION UPON ORAL EXAMINATION OF LEAH CRAWFORD ___________________________________________________________ APPEARANCES: FOR THE PLAINTIFF: JAMES E. LOBSENZ CARNEY, BADLEY, SPELLMAN 701 FIFTH AVENUE, SUITE 3600 SEATTLE, WASHINGTON 98104 STEPHEN J. BUCKINGHAM U.S. DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE 20 MASSACHUSETTS AVENUE NW WASHINGTON, DC 20044

FOR THE DEFENDANTS:

MARCH 17, 2010 SEATTLE, WASHINGTON

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and... Q

Didn't get to catch up with her.

And was that the last time you had contacted her, or have you e-mailed with her or sent her a letter or any other contact with her since then?

A Q

No. And could you tell me again why you think Maj. Witt was discharged?

A Q

For an accusation that she was a lesbian. Do you feel like you know the facts surrounding Maj. Witt's discharge?

A Q

No. Do you think that there are facts that you don't know about Maj. Witt's discharge?

A Q

Yes. Has anyone explained to you Maj. Witt's discharge fact by fact?

A Q

No. Anyone in a position of authority at the Air Force tell you about Maj. Witt's discharge?

A

No.

There -- The commander had mentioned something a

couple months back stating that this was going to be in the news and that there was a person that used to be in our unit that got kicked out because of the don't ask/don't tell; that was it. Q Did she give you any other information?

EXHIBIT L
Deposition of Stacey Julian

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT WESTERN DISTRICT OF WASHINGTON AT TACOMA ____________________________________________________________ ) MAJOR MARGARET WITT, ) ) Plaintiff, ) ) v. ) No. C06-5195 RBL ) UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF THE ) AIR FORCE, et al, ) ) Defendants. ) ____________________________________________________________ DEPOSITION UPON ORAL EXAMINATION OF MASTER SERGEANT STACEY JULIAN ____________________________________________________________ TAKEN AT Carney Badley Spellman 701 Fifth Avenue, Suite 3600 Seattle, WA 98104

MARCH 18, 2010

THURSDAY, 1:30 P.M.

Reported by: MARIE WHITE, CSR # WH-IT-EM-*29906

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supposed to contact them first, give them a list of names, then they would contact you together type deal, so that there was a process they wanted us to follow that process. Q. So that is why instead of returning my messages you did what? You went to Command and said I have gotten this

contact? A. Q. Right. At the same time are you generally aware that I was able to talk to your wife? A. Q. I am. And she -- I don't know, would you have been there when she was explaining to me why you were not returning the calls? A. I was, but we had guests that night, so she was in another room, so I didn't hear the conversation. Q. Okay. future? A. Q. Not currently. Why are we laughing? Because you think somebody else Do you have any plans to retire in the immediate

might have plans for you? A. Well, my wife wants me to retire. have any current plans to retire. MR. LOBSENZ: Okay. I am probably done, but If I But, no, I don't

I'll take a short recess, talk to my colleague.

EXHIBIT M
Deposition of Jill Robinson

1

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT WESTERN DISTRICT OF WASHINGTON AT TACOMA ___________________________________________________________ MAJOR MARGARET WITT, ) ) Plaintiff, ) ) vs. ) C065195RBL ) UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF ) THE AIR FORCE; COLONEL MARY L.) WALKER, Commander 446th ) Aeromedical Evacuation ) Squadron, McChord Air Force ) Base; and JAMES G. ROCHE, ) SECRETARY, DEPARTMENT OF THE ) AIR FORCE, ) ) Defendants. ) ___________________________________________________________ DEPOSITION UPON ORAL EXAMINATION OF JILL ROBINSON ___________________________________________________________ APPEARANCES: FOR THE PLAINTIFF: JAMES E. LOBSENZ CARNEY, BADLEY, SPELLMAN 701 FIFTH AVENUE, SUITE 3600 SEATTLE, WASHINGTON 98104 PETER J. PHIPPS STEPHEN J. BUCKINGHAM U.S. DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE 20 MASSACHUSETTS AVENUE NW WASHINGTON, DC 20044

FOR THE DEFENDANTS:

MARCH 16, 2010

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but I don't -- I haven't seen him since he left. Q Did you ever hear anyone in the unit complain that they were serving with Toni Wilson believed to be a lesbian? A Q No. Did you ever hear anyone complain that they were serving with Bill Barkley, a man assumed to be a gay person? A Q A No. No? Odd behaviors. wasn't... Q A Q Let's see, did you say, did Toni Wilson have a partner? I did not say. I don't know if she did. He was just a quirky guy and but there

And Bill Barkley after his break up of his marriage, do you know whether he had a partner or not?

A Q

No. Now, aside from those three people, Lisa Chisa, Toni Wilson, Bill Barkley, there's some other people who are still in; is that correct?

A Q A Q

Yes. Who you believe to be gay or lesbian; right? Correct. First of all, just how many in numbers, other people is that group in your mind?

A Q

Six. Six. Okay. And of those six, how many are gay men and

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Q

And I think my question went to did she ever tell you specifically why she's no longer employed by the Air Force?

A Q A Q A Q

Not specifically. Okay. Yes. And what was that general idea? It was that she was a lesbian. And did she tell you that, or did you hear that through rumors? Did you get a general idea as to why?

A Q

Through rumors. But you didn't know the specific facts regarding what led to her suspension and discharge?

A Q

The specifics and details, no. Have you voluntarily provided statements in support of her case?

A

Yes.

I could be construed as supporting based on

characters, as stated. MR. PHIPPS: Speaking of statements, let me

hand you what we'll mark as Exhibit 1. (Exhibit Number 1 marked.) Q A Q A Now, do you recognize this document? Yes. What is it? Labeled as a character reference referring to

EXHIBIT N
Deposition of Kenneth Winslow

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT WESTERN DISTRICT OF WASHINGTON AT TACOMA ____________________________________________________________ ) MAJOR MARGARET WITT, ) ) Plaintiff, ) ) v. ) No. C06-5195 RBL ) UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF THE ) AIR FORCE, et al, ) ) Defendants. ) ____________________________________________________________ DEPOSITION UPON ORAL EXAMINATION OF LIEUTENANT COLONEL KENNETH WINSLOW ____________________________________________________________ TAKEN AT Carney Badley Spellman 701 Fifth Avenue, Suite 3600 Seattle, WA 98104

MARCH 18, 2010

THURSDAY, 9:00 A.M.

Reported by: MARIE WHITE, CSR # WH-IT-EM-*29906

Page 56 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A. Q. A. Q. A. Q. A. Q. A. Q. BY MR. BUCKINGHAM: Q. Lieutenant Colonel Winslow, do you feel like you know why Major Witt was discharged? Yes, I do now. Do you feel like you know the entire story? No. Do you think that there are facts surrounding her discharge that you don't know about? Yes. Were you close with Major Witt? I guess you'd have to define close. Would you consider her a friend? Yes. When was the last time you saw her? MR. BUCKINGHAM: Stamp on this? MR. LOBSENZ: This one doesn't. I am trying I'm sorry, is there a Bates

to remember which, this is already an exhibit to someone else's deposition. MS. KUNG: To Colonel Moore-Harbert. Colonel Moore-Harbert's.

MR. LOBSENZ:

Because her signature, I think, is on here somewhere, too. ***** CROSS EXAMINATION

EXHIBIT O
Deposition of Edmund Hrivnak

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UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT WESTERN DISTRICT OF WASHINGTON AT TACOMA ___________________________________________________________ MAJOR MARGARET WITT, ) ) Plaintiff, ) ) vs. ) C065195RBL ) UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF ) THE AIR FORCE; COLONEL MARY L.) WALKER, Commander 446th ) Aeromedical Evacuation ) Squadron, McChord Air Force ) Base; and JAMES G. ROCHE, ) SECRETARY, DEPARTMENT OF THE ) AIR FORCE, ) ) Defendants. ) ___________________________________________________________ DEPOSITION UPON ORAL EXAMINATION OF EDMOND HRIVNAK ___________________________________________________________ APPEARANCES: FOR THE PLAINTIFF: JAMES E. LOBSENZ CARNEY, BADLEY, SPELLMAN 701 FIFTH AVENUE, SUITE 3600 SEATTLE, WASHINGTON 98104 PETER J. PHIPPS STEPHEN J. BUCKINGHAM U.S. DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE 20 MASSACHUSETTS AVENUE NW WASHINGTON, DC 20044

FOR THE DEFENDANTS:

MARCH 17, 2010

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you're talking five years ago. Q So, let's talk about May 2005 when you really left the unit. A Q A Yeah. How many gays and lesbians combined? Well, I didn't keep count. MR. PHIPPS: MR. LOBSENZ: A Objection. Foundation.

That's okay.

I didn't keep count, but I would guess six to eight gays and lesbians.

Q

I'm not at this moment anyway, asking you for any names, okay?

A Q

Okay. But just at this moment what proportion of that six to eight or so, is it evenly divided men and women, do you think it's more one gender than the other, what?

A

I would say, yeah, more female than male.

I mean, we're

a medical unit, so there's generally more females than males. Q A Q A Q Okay. So, just the numbers? Okay. And so I would say six female lesbians, two gay men. Are any of the people that you believe are gay or lesbian now presently retired from the Air Force?