Apple Inc. v. Samsung Electronics Co. Ltd. et al

Filing 1356

Unredacted Opening Memroandum Regarding Claim Construction by Samsung Electronics America, Inc.(a New York corporation), Samsung Electronics Co. Ltd., Samsung Telecommunications America, LLC(a Delaware limited liability company) re 1256 Order on Administrative Motion to File Under Seal, re (Dkt. Nos. 1090, 1091) (Attachments: # 1 Exhibit 4 to the Cashman Declaration, # 2 Exhibit 14 to the Cashman Declaration, # 3 Exhibit 15 to the Cashman Declaration, # 4 Exhibit 17 to the Cashman Declaration, # 5 Exhibit 18 to the Cashman Declaration, # 6 Exhibit 20 to the Cashman Declaration, # 7 Exhibit 63 to the Cashman Declaration, # 8 Exhibit 64 to the Cashman Declaration, # 9 Exhibit 65 to the Cashman Declaration, # 10 Exhibit 66 to the Cashman Declaration)(Maroulis, Victoria) (Filed on 7/26/2012) Modified text on 7/27/2012 (dhm, COURT STAFF).

EXHIBIT 17
FILED UNDER SEAL

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UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

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NORTHERN DISTRICT OF CALIFORNIA

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SAN JOSE DIVISION

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APPLE INC., a California
corporation,

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Plaintiff,

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vs.

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SAMSUNG ELECTRONICS CO., LTD.,
a Korean business entity;
SAMSUNG ELECTRONICS AMERICA,
INC., a New York corporation;
SAMSUNG TELECOMMUNICATIONS
AMERICA, LLC, a Delaware
limited liability company,

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Case No. 11-CV-01846-LHK

Defendants.
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CONFIDENTIAL ATTORNEYS' EYES ONLY

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VIDEOTAPED DEPOSITION OF DANIELE De IULIIS
Redwood Shores, California
Friday, October 21, 2011

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Reported by:
LORRIE L. MARCHANT, CSR No. 10523, RPR, CRR, CCRR,CLR
JOB NO. 43000

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TSG Reporting 877-702-9580

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Friday, October 21, 2011
10:13 a.m.

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Videotaped Deposition of DANIELE De

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IULIIS, held at the offices of Quinn

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Emanuel Urqhart & Sullivan, LLP, 555

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Twin Dolphin Drive, Suite 560, Redwood

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Shores, California, before Lorrie L.

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Marchant, a Certified Shorthand

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Reporter, Registered Professional

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Reporter, Certified Realtime Reporter,

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California Certified Realtime Reporter

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and Certified LiveNote Reporter.

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A P P E A R A N C E S:
FOR THE PLAINTIFF APPLE INC.:
MORRISON & FOERSTER
BY: ANDREW E. MONACH, ESQ.
425 Market Street
San Francisco, California 94105
Phone: [phone]
Fax: [phone]
e-mail: [e-mail]
FOR THE DEFENDANTS SAMSUNG:
QUINN EMANUEL URQUHART & SULLIVAN
BY: MARGRET CARUSO, ESQ.
SCOTT HALL, ESQ.
555 Twin Dolphin Drive
Redwood Shores, California 94065
Phone: [phone]
Fax: [phone]
e-mail: [e-mail]
[e-mail]
ALSO PRESENT:

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Lisa Olle, Apple Senior Corporate Counsel, Litigation

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Jason Kocol, Videographer

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---oOo---

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THE VIDEOGRAPHER:

This is the start of

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tape labeled No. 1 of the videotaped deposition of

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Daniele de Iuliis in the matter Apple, Incorporated

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versus Samsung Electronics Company, Limited, in the

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United States District Court, Northern District of

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California, San Jose Division.

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11-CV-01846-LHK.

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Case No.

This deposition is being held at 555 Twin
Dolphin Drive, Redwood Shores, California, on

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October 21st, 2011, at approximately 10:13 a.m.

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name is Jason Kocol.

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from TSG Reporting, Incorporated, headquartered at

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747 Third Avenue, New York, New York.

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My

I'm the legal video specialist

The court reporter is Lorrie Marchant in
association with TSG Reporting.
Will counsel please introduce yourselves
for the record.
MS. CARUSO:

Margret Caruso from Quinn,

Emanuel, Urquhart, Sullivan for defendant Samsung.
MR. MONACH:

Andrew Monach, Morrison &

Foerster, representing Apple and the witness.
THE VIDEOGRAPHER:

Will the court reporter

please swear in the witness.
THE REPORTER:

Do you solemnly swear or

affirm under the penalties of perjury that the

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testimony you are about to offer will be the truth,

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the whole truth and nothing but the truth?

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THE WITNESS:

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I do.

EXAMINATION BY MS. CARUSO

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BY MS. CARUSO:

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Q.

Good morning.

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A.

Good morning.

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Q.

Have you ever been deposed before?

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A.

I have not.

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Q.

Okay.

If at any point during the

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deposition you would like some more water or would

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like to take a break, just let me know.

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accommodate that.

We can

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A.

Okay.

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Q.

I just ask that you finish answering

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whatever question I asked at the time.

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A.

Thank you.

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Q.

Let's just step back a little bit.

There's

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going to be a lot of memory lane for you.

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could tell me a little bit about your education

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since graduating from high school.

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A.

If you

I graduated from Central School of Art and

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Design in London in 1983 with a BA in industrial

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design engineering.

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then.

I've been a professional since

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THE WITNESS:
button.

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BY MS. CARUSO:

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This, I believe, is the power

Q.

Is the power button on the iPod touch a

continuous form at its top?

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MR. MONACH:

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THE WITNESS:

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Vague.

Help me understand that

question.

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BY MS. CARUSO:

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Objection.

Q.

So in Figure 7, the figure that is shown in

C --

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

-- has a broken lozenge shape.

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that?

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Do you see

MR. MONACH:

Object to the form of the

question.

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THE WITNESS:

I see a lozenge, and it's

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badly photocopied and -- or what appears to be a

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lozenge, and that is broken in a couple of places.

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BY MS. CARUSO:
Q.

Do you have any understanding of why it's

broken in a couple of places?
A.

I don't understand why it would be broken

in a couple of places.
Q.

You're not aware of any feature of the iPod

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touch that would require depicting this button in

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this fashion?

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MR. MONACH:

Objection to the extent it

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lacks foundation.

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for a legal conclusion.

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Calls for speculation or calls

THE WITNESS:

These drawings are drawings

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made by a patent attorney.

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why they would be drawn in this manner.

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I don't know the reasons

BY MS. CARUSO:

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Q.

I'm going to hand you something that I

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think that you've seen before.

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up for the camera so there's an image of it

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recorded.

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If you could hold it

Do you have an understanding of what this
is?
A.

This is what I believe to be an early

prototype of a tablet we were developing.
Q.

When you say "we," do you mean the

industrial design group of Apple?

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A.

I mean Apple.

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Q.

When was Apple working on developing this

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tablet?
A.

To the best of my knowledge -- it was

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definitely before the iPhone development, and to the

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best of my knowledge, around 2003.

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Q.

Did you work on the design of this tablet?

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A.

I worked alongside my colleagues in the

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industrial design department as a collective and as

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a team on this.

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7
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Q.

Approximately how many months did you spend

working on this design?
A.

We spent -- I really don't recall.

It's

going back a long time.

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Q.

More than three months?

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A.

Yes.

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I'm guessing.

My best guess would be

yes, more than three months.
Q.

Did you create any sketches relating to the

development of this tablet design?

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A.

I may have.

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Q.

Is it common that you work on a design for

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more than three months and don't create a single

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sketch related to it?

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MR. MONACH:

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Objection.

THE WITNESS:

Vague.

I believe I mentioned to you

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earlier that we tend to go into three dimensions

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very, very quickly.

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That's generally how we work.

BY MS. CARUSO:
Q.

Is it common that you work on a design for

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more than three months and don't create a single

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sketch related to it?

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MR. MONACH:

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THE WITNESS:

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BY MS. CARUSO:

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Q.

Objection.

Vague.

It's possible.

Is it your understanding that you didn't

create any sketches relating to tablet design?

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A.

I don't remember.

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Q.

Have you gone back to look through your

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sketchbooks from the 2003 time period to see if

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there were any sketches relating to the tablet

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design?
A.

I don't remember the dates that were asked

for us to look at.
Q.

So I don't remember the dates.

You referred to this -- did you call it an

early prototype of the tablet design?
A.

I don't remember if I called it an early

prototype or a prototype.

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Q.

Do you agree that it's an early prototype?

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A.

I agree that it's a prototype.

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prototype by definition is -- anyway.
Q.

I guess a
I'm sorry.

You've been handed what has been marked as

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Exhibit 8, Lutton Exhibit 8.

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Do you have that in

front of you?

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

Do you -- and that is US Design Patent

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504889 --

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

-- correct?

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You're named as an inventor of this design;
is that correct?

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

Did you participate in the team that

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created this design?

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A.

I did.

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Q.

Does this D889 reflect the design of the

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prototype that's in front of you?

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MR. MONACH:

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foundation.

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Vague.

Objection.

Lack of

Objection, calls for a legal

conclusion.

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THE WITNESS:

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I believe so.

BY MS. CARUSO:

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Q.

Do you see Figure 6 of the D889 patent?

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A.

I do.

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Q.

There's a circular element on that.

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Do you

see it?

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A.

I do.

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Q.

Do you also see that on the prototype that

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you're holding?

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A.

I do.

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Q.

In Figure 1 of the D889 patent, there's

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a -- a line that's thicker than the other lines.

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you see that?

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MR. MONACH:

Objection.

Vague.

Objection

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to the extent it may not accurately reflect the

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drawing.

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THE WITNESS:

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BY MS. CARUSO:

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Q.

I see a bad photocopy.

Starting at the left, do you see three

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parallel lines on the left-hand side of the top

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drawing?

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A.

I do.

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Q.

Do you see the middle line of those three?

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A.

I do.

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Q.

Does it appear to you to be thicker than

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the other two?

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A.

Yes.

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Q.

Do you have an understanding of why it's

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thicker?

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MR. MONACH:

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foundation.

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Objection.

Lack of

Objection to the extent it calls for a

legal conclusion.

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THE WITNESS:

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BY MS. CARUSO:

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Q.

I don't.

Do you have any understanding of what that

middle line represents?
MR. MONACH:

Same objection.

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MR. MONACH:

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THE WITNESS:

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Vague.

I don't understand if I

understand your definition.

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Objection.

BY MS. CARUSO:
Q.

Did the gap -- why was there a gap?

I'll

ask that question.

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A.

I really don't remember.

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Q.

If you'd look at this --

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A.

Thank you.

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Q.

-- and if you could just hold that up again

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for the camera.

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THE VIDEOGRAPHER:
the front.

I didn't get a shot of

You have to hold it longer for me.

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Thank you.

Great.

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BY MS. CARUSO:

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Q.

Does that prototype also have a gap?

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A.

It does.

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Q.

And is there anything sort of in the

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interior of that gap that you can see?

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MR. MONACH:

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Objection.

THE WITNESS:

Vague.

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you're calling the gap.

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I see a detail within what

BY MS. CARUSO:

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Q.

Is that detail found in the first prototype

you were looking at, as well?

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A.

They appear to be similar.

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Q.

Do you recall any discussions about that

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detail?

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A.

Having seen it now for the first time in

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many years, I remember working as a team on this

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detail.

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Q.

Do you remember any discussion about the

detail?

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A.

I don't.

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Q.

Do you remember any reason why it added

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esthetically to the product?

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MR. MONACH:

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THE WITNESS:

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Vague.

Probably had a very good

reason at the time.

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BY MS. CARUSO:

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Objection.

Q.

But you can't recall right now what that

was?

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A.

I can't recall.

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Q.

And I asked you about any esthetic reason

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for putting it there.

Do you remember any other

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reason for having that detail?

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A.

I don't recall.

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Q.

Is it your understanding that Figure 1

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reflects that detail?
MR. MONACH:

Object to the form of the

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question to the extent it calls for a legal

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conclusion.

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But you can review that figure and give
your understanding.

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THE WITNESS:

the gap that's shown here.

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I believe that line reflects

BY MS. CARUSO:
Q.

I take it that as with the other design

patents we discussed, you can't call out any

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particular contribution made by any member of the

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design team with respect to the design of the D889

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patent; is that correct?

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A.

That's correct.

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Q.

Would you describe the surface of this

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prototype as contiguous from end to end?

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MR. MONACH:

Object to the form of the

question as vague.

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THE WITNESS:

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glass here as being contiguous.

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BY MS. CARUSO:

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Q.

I would describe the piece of

Would you describe the glass surface as

extending to the outside of the product?

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MR. MONACH:

Objection.

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THE WITNESS:

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Vague.

I would categorize it that way.

I don't know if I'd say -- if

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BY MS. CARUSO:

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Q.

Why not?

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A.

Well, you said to the outside of the

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product.

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Q.

M-hm.

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A.

And the glass stops.

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It doesn't go to the

outside of the product.
Q.

Would you describe the surface of the

iPhone as extending to the outside of the product?

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MR. MONACH:

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BY MS. CARUSO:

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Q.

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Vague.

I'll reask the question.
Would you describe the glass surface of the

iPhone as extending to the outside of the product?
A.

I would describe the glass surface

extending to the bezel.

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Objection.

MS. CARUSO:

We need to take a short break

to change the tape.

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THE VIDEOGRAPHER:

This marks the end of

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Tape No. 3 in today's deposition of Daniele de

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Iuliis.

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record.

The time is 5:29 p.m.

We are off the

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(Recess taken, from 5:29 to 5:38.)

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THE VIDEOGRAPHER:

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This marks the beginning

of Tape No. 4 in today's deposition of Daniele de

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MS. CARUSO: No further questions'

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MR. MONACH:

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I
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MS. CARUSO: Thank You.

This marks the end of
Tape No. 4 of 4 and concludes t,oday's deposition of
The time is 5:41 p'm' We are
Daniele de Iulíis,
off the record.
(Time Noted: 5:41 P.m.)
---oOo--THE VIDEOGRAPHER:

t1
T2

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DANIELE DC

IULIIS

L4
1_5

L6

Thank

your sir.

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5

I have no questions'

Subscribed and shrorn to
beforer me this tL.l. ¿"v

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ytttùlzot f.i

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TSG

Reporting

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