AMERICAN SOCIETY FOR TESTING AND MATERIALS et al v. PUBLIC.RESOURCE.ORG, INC.

Filing 164

REPLY in support of motion re #163 SEALED MOTION FOR LEAVE TO FILE DOCUMENT UNDER SEAL filed by PUBLIC.RESOURCE.ORG, INC. (This document is SEALED and only available to authorized persons.), #120 SEALED MOTION FOR LEAVE TO FILE DOCUMENT UNDER SEAL filed by PUBLIC.RESOURCE.ORG, INC. (This document is SEALED and only available to authorized persons.) filed by PUBLIC.RESOURCE.ORG, INC.. (Attachments: #1 [Redacted] Declaration of Matthew Becker, #2 [Redacted] Consolidated List of Exhibits, #3 [Redacted] Response to Supplemental Statement of Facts, #4 [Redacted] Response to Statement of Disputed Facts, #5 Supplemental Objections to Evidence, #6 Response to Evidentiary Objections, #7 Supplemental Request for Judicial Notice, #8 Supplemental Declaration of Carl Malamud, #9 Exhibit 1, #10 Exhibit 2, #11 Exhibit 3, #12 Exhibit 4, #13 Exhibit 5, #14 Exhibit 6, #15 Exhibit [Redacted] 7, #16 Exhibit 8, #17 Exhibit 9, #18 Exhibit [Redacted] 10, #19 Exhibit [Redacted] 11, #20 Exhibit 12, #21 Exhibit 13, #22 Exhibit 14, #23 Exhibit 15, #24 Exhibit 16, #25 Exhibit 17)(Bridges, Andrew) Modified text on 2/5/2016 (ztd).

EXHIBIT 3

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UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

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FOR THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA

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Civil Action No. 1:13-cv-01215-TSC
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AMERICAN SOCIETY FOR

)

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TESTING AND MATERIALS,

)

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d/b/a ASTM INTERNATIONAL;

)

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NATIONAL FIRE PROTECTION

)

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ASSOCIATION, INC.; and

)

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AMERICAN SOCIETY OF

)

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HEATING, REFRIGERATION AND

)

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AIR CONDITIONING ENGINEERS,

)

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Plaintiffs and

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Counter-Defendants,

)

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vs.

)

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PUBLIC.RESOURCE.ORG,INC.,

)

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Defendant and

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Counter-Plaintiff.

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VIDEOTAPED 30(b)(6) DEPOSITION
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OF DONALD P. BLISS, taken before Jeanette

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N. Maracas, Registered Professional Reporter

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and Notary Public in and for the Commonwealth

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of Massachusetts, at 42 Chauncy Street, Boston,

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Massachusetts, on Tuesday, March 3, 2015,

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commencing at 9:10 a.m.

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PAGES 1 - 244
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1 A. That's the standard for criteria for

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and standards and not documents that are

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considered guidelines or recommended

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at a fire scene, guidance on the preservation 12:30:21

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practices, then no.

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of evidence, preparation of reports,

4 Q. What guidelines or recommended practice

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determining the source or origin of a fire.

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conducting an origin and cause investigation

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6 Q. It set out some method for them to bring
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to their investigation of the fire?

8 A. Yes.

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activities of the fire investigation?

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consistency with how all of our fire

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investigations were performed because it's

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a standard or best practice to ensure that

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the key elements of an investigation were

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adhered to consistent with their training,

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their education, their knowledge.

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being adopted as a regulation or a law?

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MR. REHN: Objection as to form.

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that they may be adopted as a regulation
or a law.

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It sounded as though you were distinguishing

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between guidelines and recommended practices, 12:35:26
on the one hand, and some other parts of

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12:32:11

1 Q. Do you know how many standards or codes
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codes and standards, correct?

25 A. Yes.

into law?

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NFPA publishes that have not been adopted

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5 Q. Do you know how many codes or standards
would consider to be current versions? By
that question I want you to exclude earlier
versions.

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NFPA has published that are now what you

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10 A. I don't know.
12 A. No.

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12:32:51
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11 Q. Can you give an estimate?

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13 Q. Are you aware of any NFA (sic) codes or
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law?

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standards that have not been adopted into

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16 A. I couldn't speculate one way or the other,
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so the answer, no.

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18 Q. I think I misspoke in my earlier question.

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I said NFA, but you understood that question

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to be NFPA?

21 A. Yes.

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22 Q. So you're not aware, as you sit here, of
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any NFPA codes or standards that have not

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been adopted into law?

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12:33:49

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25 A. If you're specifically referring to codes

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or codes are written for the purposes of

Page 106

4 A. No.

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20 Q. Your previous answer referred to purposes.

12:32:04

MR. REHN: Object as to form.

written for the purposes of being adopted
as a regulation or a law.

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12:34:39

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investigations?

24 A. Yes.

they're not in written, specifically not

17 A. The standards are written in such a fashion

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21 Q. So it provided a consistent process for
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9 A. To my knowledge, none of them because
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12:31:41

the fire investigators to follow in their

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may call for a legal conclusion.

13 Q. Whereas the other parts of the standards

14 A. One of the things that it provided was
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MR. REHN: Objection as to form,

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12:31:15

MR. REHN: Object as to form. It's
pretty vague.

law or adopted into law?

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perhaps how NFPA 921 contributed to the

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12:34:03

documents have not been incorporated into

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12:30:44

9 Q. Can you explain to me with some examples

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5

12:30:39

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12:35:52

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Page 108

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Q. What would you call the parts of standards
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that are not guidelines or recommended
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practices?
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MR. REHN: Objection as to form,
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vague.
12:36:08
A. I was just trying to clarify that a
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recommended practice or a guideline, even
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though it has a NFPA number, is not a
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standard.
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Q. I understand your statement on that, but
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you were distinguishing the purpose of the
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recommended guidelines -- sorry, of the
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guidelines and recommended practices from
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the purpose of other parts of these
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documents, is that correct?
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MR. REHN: I believe that
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mischaracterizes the testimony. I object
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on that basis.
12:36:44
MR. BRIDGES: I'm happy for him
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to straighten me out because I want to
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understand the distinction.
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A. The recommended practice or the guideline
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is exactly what the category designation
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implies, that it's a guidance document, not 12:37:02
an enforceable or a -- it doesn't reach the 12:37:08

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this is the end of Tape No. 4.

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MR. REHN: 6:02.

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VIDEOGRAPHER: 6:02, excuse me. We

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are now off the record.
(Whereupon the deposition was

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concluded at 6:02 p.m.)

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COMMONWEALTH OF MASSACHUSETTS)
SUFFOLK, SS. )

I, Jeanette Maracas, Registered
Professional Reporter and Notary Public in
and for the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, do
hereby certify that there came before me on
the 3rd day of March, 2015, at 9:10 a.m., the
person hereinbefore named, who was by me duly
sworn to testify to the truth and nothing but
the truth of his knowledge touching and
concerning the matters in controversy in this
cause; that he was thereupon examined upon
his oath, and his examination reduced to
typewriting under my direction; and that the
deposition is a true record of the testimony
given by the witness.
I further certify that I am neither
attorney or counsel for, nor related to or
employed by, any attorney or counsel employed
by the parties hereto or financially
interested in the action.
In witness whereof, I have hereunto
set my hand this 9th day of March, 2015.

Notary Public
My commission expires 8/14/20

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I declare under penalty of perjury
2 under the laws that the foregoing is
3 true and correct.
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Executed on _________________ , 20___,
6 at _____________, ___________________________.
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_____________________________
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Donald Bliss
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