Apple Inc. v. Samsung Electronics Co. Ltd. et al

Filing 1381

Unredacted Declaration of Brett Arnold ISO Samsung's MSJ by Samsung Electronics America, Inc.(a New York corporation), Samsung Electronics Co. Ltd., Samsung Telecommunications America, LLC(a Delaware limited liability company) re 1256 Order on Administrative Motion to File Under Seal, (Dkt. Nos. 930, 943) (Attachments: # 1 Exhibit 1 to Arnold, # 2 Exhibit 2 to Arnold, # 3 Exhibit 3 to Arnold, # 4 Exhibit 5 to Arnold, # 5 Exhibit 10 to Arnold, # 6 Exhibit 11 to Arnold, # 7 Exhibit 12 to Arnold, # 8 Exhibit 15 to Arnold)(Maroulis, Victoria) (Filed on 7/26/2012) Modified text on 7/27/2012 (dhm, COURT STAFF).

EXHIBIT 2

Confidential Business Information
Pursuant to Protective Order

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UNITED STATES INTERNATIONAL TRADE COMMISSION

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WASHINGTON, D.C.

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In the Matter of:

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CERTAIN ELECTRONIC DIGITAL
MEDIA DEVICES AND COMPONENTS

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Inv. No.

337-TA-796

THEREOF
____________________________/

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CONFIDENTIAL BUSINESS INFORMATION

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PURSUANT TO THE PROTECTIVE ORDER

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VIDEOTAPED DEPOSITION OF CHRISTOPHER J. STRINGER

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REDWOOD SHORES, CALIFORNIA

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WEDNESDAY, FEBRUARY 15, 2012

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BY:

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CSR LICENSE NO. 9830

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JOB NO. 46383

ANDREA M. IGNACIO HOWARD, CSR, RPR, CCRR, CLR

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it was chosen.

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something is true or not.

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Q

I'm asking a question about whether

With respect to the first iPhone that you

4

have there in your hand, is an advantage of

5

integrating the touch screen into the display to make

6

the display touch sensitive is that this type of

7

arrangement can save space and reduce visual clutter?

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MR. JACOBS:

9

THE WITNESS:

10

THE WITNESS:

It's --

MR. JACOBS:

11

Objection --

-- form; logical disconnect.
-- it seems logical that what

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you've stated as fact is true.

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some nonobvious things that occur inside enclosures.

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For example, how it behaves in drop, whether it's one

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completely bonded laminated structure versus separate

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layers with air gaps.

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that occur that can cause damage in various ways to

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various parts of that structure.

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However, there are

There are nonobvious things

So it is not necessarily true that the

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overall product is thinner because you may have a

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thinner module, but you might need more clearance

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space behind it.

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considering space to be a part.

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thinner.

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And in the sum of those parts, I'm
Maybe it isn't

So I can't -- though it seems obvious that
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your statement was true, there are cases where it is

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not.

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4
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MR. ZELLER:

Well, I'm not asking about other

cases.
Q

I'm asking specifically about the context of

the first iPhone that you have there in front of you.
A

And because I cannot recall the exact nature

8

of the construction of this phone and clearances and

9

so on, I cannot answer your question any better than I

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11

already have.
Q

So you have my complete answer.

And if I understand you correctly, you can't

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tell me specifically whether it's true or not as to

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this first iPhone that an advantage of integrating the

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touch screen into the display was to make the

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display -- in order to make the display touch

16

sensitive was that this type of arrangement can save

17

space and reduce visual clutter; is that correct?

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MR. JACOBS:

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THE WITNESS:

Objection; form.
I believe that combining those

20

technologies can make things thinner.

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it did in the case of this phone, I cannot speak to

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that.

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MR. ZELLER:

Q.

Whether or not

Directing your attention to

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Column 5 of the '462 patent.

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that first paragraph at the top there in Column 5,
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which runs through lines 1 through 12, to yourself.

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A

Okay.

3

Q

First, you generally recognize the context

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that is being discussed here is -- is the bezel --

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A

Yes.

6

Q

-- for the -- for the phone, and in

7

particular the configuration of the bezel as shown in

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Figure 1 of the drawing -- that drawing we looked at;

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right?

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A

Uh-huh.

11

Q

I'm sorry.

12

A

Yes.

13

Q

And you'll see this language here.

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That's a yes?

Excuse me.
It says:

"In configurations such as the one shown in

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FIG 1 in which bezel is formed around the periphery of

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a surface of device (e.g., the periphery of the front

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face of device), bezel may help to prevent damage to

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display, (e.g., by shielding display from impact in

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the event that device is dropped, etc.)."

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Do you see that?

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A

I see that.

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Q

Do you believe that that's a true statement?

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A

It may help --

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MR. JACOBS:

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THE WITNESS:

Objection; form.
-- it may help, as it says, but

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I'm not sure what we're comparing it to.

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3
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MR. ZELLER:
Q

I'm sorry.

Are you saying you don't understand this

statement, or are you -A

I agree that it may help.

But I don't know

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that it does help because to determine that, we need

7

to be comparing it to some other material for some

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relative measure.

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philosophical and non -- not practical.

10
11

Q

Well, do you have an understanding as to what

this statement means that I just read?

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13

MR. JACOBS:

Objection; form; harassing the

witness.

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15

Otherwise, this is almost

THE WITNESS:

It seems to me that you're

asking if it might help.

And I agreed it might.

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MR. ZELLER:

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about an Apple patent here.

Q.

Well, I'm not -- I'm asking

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A

Yes.

19

Q

Using Apple's language.

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A

Yes.

21

Q

And my question is:

Do you have an

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understanding as to when it says "in configurations

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such as the one shown in FIG. 1," and continues on, do

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you have an understanding of the meaning --

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A

Yes.
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Q

-- of that sentence?

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A

Absolutely.

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Q

And when you were saying you -- earlier that

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you weren't sure what it's being compared to, do you

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have an understanding as to what this is being

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compared to?

7

A

No.

I have an understanding of some legal

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text here that doesn't make complete sense to me as a

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designer.

But it's -- it suggests -- to me, it's

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suggesting that it may help prevent damage to a

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display.

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that I understand the language as a designer.

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Q

That is a very nonspecific claim in the way

Well, let's then step back for a moment,

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and -- and let's talk about the first iPhone that you

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have in front of you as Exhibit 11.

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That -- that has a bezel that is formed

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around the periphery of the front surface of the

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device?

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A

Yes.

20

Q

Does that configuration of the bezel help

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prevent damage to the display, such as by shielding it

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from impact in the event that the device is dropped?

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MR. JACOBS:

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THE WITNESS:

25

Objection; form.
It is a part -- as a part of

the enclosure, depending on how it is dropped, on what
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surface, at what angle, at what speed, from what

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height, it may protect the glass.

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MR. ZELLER:

Q.

Isn't it true that Apple

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studied, at some length and expense, different

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configurations of the bezel for the first iPhone in

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order to determine what configurations best protected

7

the display screen from cracking or breaking in the

8

event that the device was dropped by the user?

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A

We made prototypes of the product that

10

included the bezel, and yes, they were dropped.

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from an appearance point of view, the design, if you

12

will, it remained unchanged in any significant way

13

through the process.

14
15

Q

Well, you say "in any significant way."

But

It

did change as a result of the drop testing; correct?

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MR. JACOBS:

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THE WITNESS:

Objection; vague.
It changed as a result of those

18

fine-tuning the design.

19

view, we were trying to decide how much of a border we

20

wanted around the glass, the angles, the dimensions,

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the corner radii.

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we wanted this thing to appear.

23

various forms along the way.

24
25

From a composition point of

MR. ZELLER:

We excruciatingly put through how

Q.

So yes, it did take

The reason why the iPhone

designs took various forms along the way was in
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response to drop test results, among other things;

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right?

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4

A

I can tell you quite plainly that this shape

is not determined as a result of drop tests.

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MR. ZELLER:

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back.

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Q

If you can read my question

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I'd ask that you focus on my question and --

and answer that question.

9
10
11

(Whereupon, record read by the Reporter as
follows:
"Q.

The reason why the iPhone designs took

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various forms along the way was in response

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to drop test results, among other things;

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right?

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16
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MR. JACOBS:

Objection; asked and answered;

harassing the witness.
THE WITNESS:

In my mind, the system, the

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combination of all the parts that compose this

19

product, was made to work to be successful in drop

20

tests, which may have taken many different paths in

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terms of internal detailing or how things are

22

connected, but it did not drive the visual design of

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this product.

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25

MR. ZELLER:
drives visual design.

I'm not asking you about what
I'm not asking about what

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you're saying is that at least in comparison to the

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hard button and the icon, you believe that the

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receiver aperture is something that's more noticeable?

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A

It is.

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Q

In your view, is the overall impression that

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this core of the iPhone design creates any different

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if you move that receiver aperture up higher toward

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the top or a bit lower than it's actually located on

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the iPhone?

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MR. JACOBS:

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THE WITNESS:

Objection; form.
I think it's a most important

12

attribute that it is centered in the X axis.

13

moved up and down a little, I don't think it would be

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a huge deal.

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MR. ZELLER:

Q.

If it

And in your view, simply

16

moving the location of that aperture would cause you

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to think that it's a -- a different design?

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MR. JACOBS:

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THE WITNESS:

Objection; form.
If the moving was just in the

20

Y axis, in this axis, it could remain visually to be

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substantially -- substantially the same.

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MR. ZELLER:

Q.

And when you say "Y axis" in

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this context, you mean up or down, at least from the

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orientation?

25

A

I know what you mean.
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We mean the same
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thing.

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MR. JACOBS:

The -- okay.

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MR. ZELLER:

What's the next number?

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THE REPORTER:

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MR. ZELLER:

Go ahead.

34.
Let's please mark as Exhibit 34

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a one-page document showing a side-by-side of three

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designs.

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(Document marked Stringer Exhibit 34

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for identification.)

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THE WITNESS:

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MR. ZELLER:

12
13

Thank you.
Q.

Do you recognize anything

that's here on Exhibit 34?
A

I recognize the center and the right images

14

as being extracted from various patent drawings that

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we've reviewed today.

16

Q

And you recognize the center and the right

17

image or drawing as being from patents that you talked

18

about earlier as depicting iPhone designs?

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A

That's right.

20

Q

Do you recognize the design on the left?

21

A

That's an interestingly phrased question.

22

It's clearly substantially the same as our patented

23

design, but I don't know what particular -- I'm

24

assuming that that is some drawing of a competitor's

25

phone, but it could just be a generic outline created
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for the purpose of the question.

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is.

3

Q

I don't know what it

Well, regardless of where it came from, in

4

your view, the design that's there on the left is the

5

same or substantially the same as the designs that are

6

shown there in the center and the right?

7

MR. JACOBS:

8

THE WITNESS:

9

yes.

Objection; form.
As I interpret the drawing,

This isn't a patent drawing, so I am not -- or

10

to my knowledge, I don't know if it's a patent

11

drawing, so I'm not looking for indications of

12

transparency or flatness.

13

really assess what it is I'm looking at.

14

I'd need more views to

But in fact, that is my -- my truly

15

considered answer is I'd like to see more views to

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know what I'm looking at.

17
18

MR. ZELLER:

Q.

Based on what you see here,

you believe that they are substantially the same?

19

MR. JACOBS:

20

THE WITNESS:

Objection; form.
Based on what I'm looking at

21

here and in one -- one manner of looking at it, then

22

yes.

23

MR. ZELLER:

Q.

Sometimes when you've talked

24

about the core of the iPhone design, you refer to it

25

as being a quiet design; do you recall that?
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Q

Focusing on that aperture or hole that

2

appears near the top of the design that's on the

3

left --

4

A

I'm assuming that is an aperture, yes.

5

Q

-- you see that it is in a higher position

6

than the apertures on the iPhone designs there in the

7

center on the right?

8

A

Uh-huh.

9

Q

I'm sorry.

10

A

Yes, I see.

11

Q

In your view, is that a minor difference, or

You said -- that's a yes?

12

is that something that to you creates a substantially

13

different overall impression in terms of the design?

14

A

In my mind --

15

MR. JACOBS:

16

THE WITNESS:

Objection; form.
-- centering the detail in X,

17

if this is indeed a receiver detail and if this is

18

indeed a phone, is very important to me.

19

placed in Y starts to become a lower-order detail.

20

MR. ZELLER:

Q.

Where it is

And just to use my own lay

21

person's terminology, when you talk about X and Y in

22

this context, you're saying that -- well, you're

23

drawing.

24
25

A

Okay.
MR. ZELLER:

And let the record reflect that

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the -- the witness has -- has actually drawn on

2

Exhibit 34 a depiction of what he's referring to as

3

the X and Y axis, and I appreciate that.

4

Q

And for the record, the X axis is running

5

across, and the Y axis is running up and down as an

6

orientation that you have there in front of you?

7

A

8

Yes.
MR. JACOBS:

Can we take a walking-around

10

MR. ZELLER:

Yeah, now is a good time.

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THE VIDEOGRAPHER:

9

break?

This marks the end of

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Volume I, Disc 5, in the deposition of Christopher

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Stringer.

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15

The time is 9:54 p.m., and we are off the
record.

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(Recess taken.)

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THE VIDEOGRAPHER:

This marks the beginning

18

of Volume I, Disc 6, in the deposition of Christopher

19

Stringer.

20

record.

21

The time is 10:06 p.m., and we're on the

MR. ZELLER:

Q.

One electronic device design

22

that was public before 2006 that you're aware of that

23

showed a clear, flat, continuous front surface that

24

ran from edge to edge was the '889 design; is that

25

correct?
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A

What was the '889 design?

I don't know

designs by their numbers.

3

Q

That was Exhibit 5.

4

A

Okay.

5

Q

And the "yes" is in response to my question?

6

A

Yes, I'm aware of that design.

7

Q

Were there other designs that you're aware of

Yes.

8

that were public before 2006 that showed, for an

9

electronic device, a clear, flat, continuous front

10
11
12
13

surface that ran from edge to edge?
A

I cannot think of any such design at this

point in time.
Q

Is there anything you've ever investigated to

14

try and determine whether there were any such designs

15

prior to 2006?

16
17

A

No, I'm not aware of having -- having a

memory of investigating such a thing.

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MR. ZELLER:

19

THE REPORTER:

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MR. ZELLER:

21

Let's please mark as Exhibit 35 a copy of

What's the next number?
It's 35.
35?

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United States Patent Application Publication

23

2004/0041504.

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25

(Document marked Stringer Exhibit 35
for identification.)
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THE WITNESS:

2

MR. ZELLER:

Thank you.
Q.

Okay.

Have you ever seen this

3

patent before, this patent application publication

4

rather?

5
6

MR. JACOBS:

You can answer outside of

deposition preparation.

7

THE WITNESS:

I have -- I think I've seen

8

this, this patent document.

9

images from it.

10

I've definitely seen

I think I've seen it in the context

of the whole document.

11

MR. ZELLER:

Q.

And what's the context in

12

which you recall seeing this patent application

13

publication or images from it?

14
15

A

deposition.

16
17

That is in a preparation meeting for this

MR. JACOBS:

discuss preparation meetings --

18

THE WITNESS:

19

MR. JACOBS:

20

THE WITNESS:

21

MR. ZELLER:

22
23

I will also instruct you not to

Oh.
-- please.
Okay.
And so let me back up for a

moment.
Q

Excluding any instance in which you saw

24

either this application publication, or portions of it

25

in connection with your deposition preparation, do you
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