Apple Inc. v. Samsung Electronics Co. Ltd. et al

Filing 2126

Declaration of Susan Estrich in Support of 2013 MOTION for Judgment as a Matter of Law, New Trial and/or Remittitur Pursuant to Federal Rules of Civil Procedure 50 and 59, 2054 Brief, 2053 Opposition/Response to Motion, filed bySamsung Electronics America, Inc.(a New York corporation), Samsung Electronics Co. Ltd., Samsung Telecommunications America, LLC. (Attachments: # 1 Exhibit 1 to the Estrich Declaration, # 2 Exhibit 2 to the Estrich Declaration, # 3 Exhibit 3 to the Estrich Declaration, # 4 Exhibit 4 to the Estrich Declaration, # 5 Exhibit 5 to the Estrich Declaration, # 6 Exhibit 6 to the Estrich Declaration, # 7 Exhibit 7 to the Estrich Declaration, # 8 Exhibit 8 to the Estrich Declaration, # 9 Exhibit 9 to the Estrich Declaration, # 10 Exhibit 10 to the Estrich Declaration, # 11 Exhibit 11 to the Estrich Declaration, # 12 Exhibit 12 to the Estrich Declaration, # 13 Exhibit 13 to the Estrich Declaration, # 14 Exhibit 14 to the Estrich Declaration, # 15 Exhibit 15 to the Estrich Declaration, # 16 Exhibit 16 to the Estrich Declaration, # 17 Exhibit 17 to the Estrich Declaration, # 18 Exhibit 18 to the Estrich Declaration, # 19 Exhibit 19 to the Estrich Declaration, # 20 Exhibit 20 to the Estrich Declaration, # 21 Exhibit 21 to the Estrich Declaration, # 22 Exhibit 22 to the Estrich Declaration, # 23 Exhibit 23 to the Estrich Declaration, # 24 Exhibit 24 to the Estrich Declaration, # 25 Exhibit 25 to the Estrich Declaration, # 26 Exhibit 26 to the Estrich Declaration, # 27 Exhibit 27 to the Estrich Declaration, # 28 Exhibit 28 to the Estrich Declaration, # 29 Exhibit 29 to the Estrich Declaration, # 30 Exhibit 30 to the Estrich Declaration, # 31 Exhibit 31 to the Estrich Declaration)(Related document(s) 2013 , 2054 , 2053 ) (Maroulis, Victoria) (Filed on 11/9/2012)

Estrich Declaration
Exhibit 2

283

1

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

2

NORTHERN DISTRICT OF CALIFORNIA

3

SAN JOSE DIVISION

4
5
6

APPLE INC., A CALIFORNIA
CORPORATION,

7
8
9
10
11
12
13

PLAINTIFF,
VS.
SAMSUNG ELECTRONICS CO.,
LTD., A KOREAN BUSINESS
ENTITY; SAMSUNG
ELECTRONICS AMERICA,
INC., A NEW YORK
CORPORATION; SAMSUNG
TELECOMMUNICATIONS
AMERICA, LLC, A DELAWARE
LIMITED LIABILITY
COMPANY,

14
DEFENDANTS.

)
)
)
)
)
)
)
)
)
)
)
)
)
)
)
)
)
)
)

C-11-01846 LHK
SAN JOSE, CALIFORNIA
JULY 31, 2012
VOLUME 2
PAGES 283-555

15
16
17

TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS
BEFORE THE HONORABLE LUCY H. KOH
UNITED STATES DISTRICT JUDGE

18
19
20

APPEARANCES ON NEXT PAGE

21
22
23
24
25

OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER: LEE-ANNE SHORTRIDGE, CSR, CRR
CERTIFICATE NUMBER 9595

284

1

A P P E A R A N C E S:

2

FOR PLAINTIFF
APPLE:

3
4

MORRISON & FOERSTER
BY: HAROLD J. MCELHINNY
MICHAEL A. JACOBS
RACHEL KREVANS
425 MARKET STREET
SAN FRANCISCO, CALIFORNIA

94105

5
6
7
8

FOR COUNTERCLAIMANT WILMER, CUTLER, PICKERING,
APPLE:
HALE AND DORR
BY: WILLIAM F. LEE
60 STATE STREET
BOSTON, MASSACHUSETTS 02109

9

BY: MARK D. SELWYN
950 PAGE MILL ROAD
PALO ALTO, CALIFORNIA

10
11

13

QUINN, EMANUEL, URQUHART,
OLIVER & HEDGES
BY: CHARLES K. VERHOEVEN
50 CALIFORNIA STREET, 22ND FLOOR
SAN FRANCISCO, CALIFORNIA 94111

14

BY:

12

FOR THE DEFENDANT:

94304

16

VICTORIA F. MAROULIS
KEVIN P.B. JOHNSON
555 TWIN DOLPHIN DRIVE
SUITE 560
REDWOOD SHORES, CALIFORNIA

17

BY:

15

18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25

94065

MICHAEL T. ZELLER
WILLIAM C. PRICE
JOHN B. QUINN
865 SOUTH FIGUEROA STREET
10TH FLOOR
LOS ANGELES, CALIFORNIA 90017

285

1
2

INDEX OF PROCEEDINGS

3
4

OPENING STATEMENT BY MR. MCELHINNY

P. 304

5

OPENING STATEMENT BY MR. LEE

P. 353

6

OPENING STATEMENT BY MR. VERHOEVEN

P. 380

7
8
9
10
11
12
INDEX OF WITNESSES

13
14

PLAINTIFF'S

15

CHRISTOPHER STRINGER
DIRECT EXAM BY MR. MCELHINNY
CROSS-EXAM BY MR. VERHOEVEN
REDIRECT EXAM BY MR. MCELHINNY

P. 469
P. 511
P. 537

PHILIP SCHILLER
DIRECT EXAM BY MR. MCELHINNY

P. 541

16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25

358

1

TELEVISION, A MICROWAVE, ALL INTO THE SAME OUTLET

2

BECAUSE THERE'S A STANDARD.

3

NOW, IN WIRELESS COMMUNICATIONS THAT WE

4

BEGAN TALKING TO YOU ABOUT YESTERDAY AND WE'RE

5

GOING TO TALK TO YOU ABOUT IN THE NEXT COUPLE OF

6

WEEKS, THERE ARE STANDARDS, TOO, STANDARDS THAT

7

ALLOW PHONES TO CONNECT TO ONE ANOTHER, STANDARDS

8

THAT ALLOW PHONES TO CONNECT OVER A WIRELESS

9

NETWORK.

10

SO WHO SETS THESE STANDARDS?

11

THE EVIDENCE WILL PROVE THAT ONE STANDARD

12

ORGANIZATION IS SOMETHING CALLED ETSI, THE EUROPEAN

13

TELECOMMUNICATIONS STANDARDS INSTITUTE.

14

DEAL STANDARDS BODY.

15

MOST POPULAR STANDARDS FOR WIRELESS COMMUNICATIONS

16

IN THE WORLD.

IT'S A BIG

IT HELPED DEVELOP SOME OF THE

17

SAMSUNG IS A MEMBER, AND HAS BEEN.

18

APPLE IS A MEMBER.

19

MOST IMPORTANTLY, THE EVIDENCE WILL

20

ESTABLISH THAT THE MEMBERS AGREE TO A SET OF RULES,

21

RULES THAT THEY WILL ALL LIVE BY, RULES THAT THEY

22

WILL ABIDE BY, RULES THAT ARE DESIGNED TO ENSURE

23

THAT PEOPLE ACT FAIRLY AND SQUARELY.

24
25

NOW, ETSI HELPED DEVELOP A STANDARD YOU
WILL LEARN CALLED UMTS.

UMTS IS SOMETIMES REFERRED

359

1

TO, AND YOU MAY HAVE SEEN IT, AS 3GPP.

2

PURPOSES, THEY ARE CLOSE TO THE SAME.

3

FOR OUR

ENGINEERS FROM DIFFERENT COMPANIES CAME

4

TOGETHER.

5

PROPOSALS.

6

STANDARD, WHAT WAS GOING TO BE THEIR EQUIVALENT OF

7

THE SOCKET.

8
9
10

THEY DISCUSSED DIFFERENT TECHNICAL
THEY DECIDED WHAT TO INCLUDE IN THE

AND THE GOAL WAS TO COME UP WITH A
STANDARD THAT EVERYBODY COULD USE TOGETHER AND IT
WOULD PROMOTE COMPETITION.

11

NOW, SAMSUNG CLAIMS THAT THE TWO PATENTS,

12

THE '941 AND THE '516, ARE ESSENTIAL TO USING UMTS.

13

SAMSUNG IS GOING TO TELL YOU IN JUST A FEW MINUTES

14

THAT IF YOU USE UMTS, YOU USE THESE PATENTS AND YOU

15

INFRINGE.
WELL, WHAT'S THE EVIDENCE GOING TO SHOW

16
17

YOU ABOUT THIS ARGUMENT?

18

FIRST, THE EVIDENCE IS GOING TO SHOW THAT

19

"DECLARED ESSENTIAL" MEANS SIMPLY THAT SAMSUNG HAS

20

SAID SO.

21

THE EVIDENCE WILL ESTABLISH THAT NO ONE,

22

NOT ETSI, NOT ANYONE ELSE, HAS EVER DECIDED THAT

23

THAT'S, IN FACT, TRUE.

24
25

YOU WILL BE THE FIRST PEOPLE TO DECIDE
WHETHER SAMSUNG'S STATEMENT THAT ITS PATENTS WERE

360

1

ESSENTIAL IS TRUE.

2

WE WILL CALL PROFESSORS EDWARD KNIGHTLY

3

FROM RICE AND PROFESSOR HYONG KIM FROM CARNEGIE

4

MELLON UNIVERSITY, TWO VERY WELL KNOWN AND

5

REPUTABLE COMPUTER SCIENTISTS AND ENGINEERS, AND

6

THEY WILL EXPLAIN TO YOU THAT THEY HAVE LOOKED AT

7

SAMSUNG'S PATENTS AND THEY ARE, IN FACT, NOT

8

ESSENTIAL TO UMTS, THAT, IN FACT, APPLE DOES NOT

9

USE THEM.

10

BUT SECOND, YOU WILL ALSO LEARN THAT THE

11

ENTIRE UMTS STANDARD IS THOUSANDS OF PAGES LONG.

12

IF I HAD IT IN THIS COURTROOM, IT WOULD GO FROM

13

HERE TO THAT WALL AND PROBABLY BACK AGAIN.

14

OUT OF THAT ENTIRE SPECIFICATION, YOU

15

WILL LEARN, THESE TWO PATENTS, EVEN UNDER SAMSUNG'S

16

CONTENTIONS, RELATE TO TWO PAGES.

17

NOW, I'D LIKE TO SHOW YOU JUST WHAT IT IS

18

IN THE IPHONE THAT SAMSUNG SAYS INFRINGES THESE TWO

19

PATENTS THAT IS ESSENTIAL TO WIRELESS

20

COMMUNICATIONS.

21

I HAVE ANOTHER IPHONE.

MR. MCELHINNY HAD

22

ONE.

23

SEE -- YOU'LL SEE SEVERAL OF THESE DURING THE

24

COURSE OF THE TRIAL -- ARE THE INSIDES.

25

I'VE TAKEN OFF THE BACK AND WHAT YOU'LL

BUT UNDERNEATH THE BLACK THAT I'M SHOWING

361

1

YOU NOW IS A HOST OF A COMPUTER CHIP AND THE

2

CONNECTIONS AND THE COMPONENTS THAT MAKE THE IPHONE

3

THE MAGICAL DEVICE THAT IT IS (INDICATING).

4

IF I WERE TO PULL OFF THIS BLACK, YOU CAN

5

SEE AT THE TOP RIGHT HERE, IF I WERE TO PULL THAT

6

OFF, YOU WOULD GET WHAT'S CALLED THE MOTHERBOARD

7

(INDICATING).

8
9

AND YOU CAN SEE ON THE MOTHERBOARD A
SERIES OF CHIPS, A SERIES OF CONNECTIONS, ALL OF

10

WHICH CONTRIBUTE TO WHAT MR. MCELHINNY DESCRIBED TO

11

YOU.

12

NOW, YOU CAN'T SEE IT NOW -- WE'LL PASS

13

THIS TO YOU WHEN IT GOES INTO EVIDENCE -- BUT I

14

HAVE TWO LITTLE DOTS HERE, AND RIGHT ABOVE THOSE

15

TWO LITTLE DOTS, I'M PUTTING MY FINGER ON THIS

16

LITTLE SQUARE HERE, NOT EVEN AS BIG AS MY FINGER.

17

WHAT IS THAT?

THAT'S THE BASEBAND

18

PROCESSOR.

19

INTEL.

20

AND A HOST OF OTHER DIFFERENT CUSTOMERS.

21

DEVICE THAT ACTUALLY PERFORMS WHAT SAMSUNG SAYS IS

22

INFRINGING, THE INTEL CHIP.

23

THAT IS SOMETHING THAT APPLE BUYS FROM

IT'S SOMETHING THAT INTEL MAKES FOR APPLE
IT IS THE

IT IS A CHIP, IT IS A CHIP THAT APPLE

24

BUYS FOR AROUND $10 APIECE, AND I'D ASK YOU TO KEEP

25

THAT IN MIND BECAUSE I'M GOING TO COME BACK TO THE

362

1

AMOUNT OF MONEY THAT SAMSUNG IS ASKING ON THESE TWO

2

PATENTS.

3

NOW, I EXPECT THAT IN A FEW MINUTES, I'M

4

SURE IN A FEW MINUTES SAMSUNG IS GOING TO GET UP

5

AND SAY, "WE PLAYED AN IMPORTANT ROLE IN DEVELOPING

6

THIS CELLULAR TELECOMMUNICATION SYSTEM.

7

PATENTS THAT ARE IN THIS BASEBAND PROCESSOR YOU BUY

8

FROM INTEL WERE OURS AND CRITICAL TO THE

9

INFORMATION HIGHWAY."

10

THESE

WELL, LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT ONE OF THE

11

HEADS OF SAMSUNG'S LICENSING DEPARTMENT, A

12

GENTLEMAN NAMED DR. AHN, TESTIFIED UNDER OATH ON

13

THIS VERY ISSUE.

14

DR. AHN REPORTS DIRECTLY TO THE CHIEF

15

EXECUTIVE OFFICER OF SAMSUNG AND HERE'S WHAT HE

16

SAID.

17

"DO YOU HAVE ANY KNOWLEDGE AS TO WHETHER

18

OR NOT SAMSUNG PLAYED AN IMPORTANT ROLE IN

19

DEVELOPING THE CELLULAR TELECOMMUNICATION SYSTEM?

20

"ANSWER:

NO, I DO NOT REALLY KNOW."

21

THE DIRECT REPORT TO THE CEO WAS ASKED

22

THAT QUESTION WHEN THIS CASE BEGAN AND THE ANSWER

23

WAS I DON'T KNOW.

24
25

NOW, WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO LEARN IS THAT
SAMSUNG DID PARTICIPATE IN THIS RULE-BASED STANDARD

363

1

SETTING PROCESS, AND WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO LEARN IS

2

THAT IN DOING SO, SAMSUNG ACTUALLY BROKE THE RULES,

3

THE RULES THAT WERE ADOPTED TO ENSURE THE STANDARD

4

PROCESS WAS FAIR AND SQUARE.

5
6

NOW, WHAT WERE THOSE RULES?

THERE WERE

TWO.

7

THE FIRST RULE IS THE RULE THAT REQUIRES

8

EVERYONE WHO HAS A PATENT THAT THEY SAY MIGHT BE

9

ESSENTIAL TO THE STANDARD TO DISCLOSE IT.

10

WHAT WILL THE EVIDENCE SHOW IS THE

11

REASON?

12

OF THE WALL SOCKET.

13

THINK ABOUT MY SIMPLE EXAMPLE OF THE PLUG,

IF I HAD A PATENT APPLICATION, A SECRET

14

PATENT APPLICATION LIKE THE VIDEO TOLD YOU ON A

15

WALL SOCKET, AND I THEN WENT TO THE STANDARD AND

16

SAID, "LET'S ALL GET TOGETHER, THE TEN OF US, AND

17

ADOPT AS A STANDARD THIS PARTICULAR CONFIGURATION,"

18

AND WE ALL GOT TOGETHER, THE TEN OF US, AND WE

19

ADOPTED THIS CONFIGURATION, AND THEN EVERYBODY IN

20

THE WORLD MADE THEIR WALL SOCKETS THAT WAY, AND

21

THEN A FEW YEARS LATER, I SAID, "I FORGOT TO TELL

22

YOU.

23

ME."

24
25

I HAVE A PATENT AND NOW YOU ALL HAVE TO PAY

WELL, ETSI HAS RULES TO PREVENT JUST
THAT, AND YOU WILL SEE RULE 4.1, AND I'M GOING TO

364

1

FOCUS YOU JUST ON THE SECOND SENTENCE WHICH SAYS,

2

"IN PARTICULAR, A MEMBER SUBMITTING A TECHNICAL

3

PROPOSAL FOR A STANDARD SHALL, ON A BONA FIDE

4

BASIS, DRAW THE ATTENTION OF ETSI TO ANY OF THAT

5

MEMBER'S IPR WHICH MIGHT BE ESSENTIAL IF THAT

6

PROPOSAL IS ADOPTED."

7

THREE THINGS YOU'LL LEARN ABOUT THAT VERY

8

IMPORTANT SIMPLE SENTENCE.

9

PATENTS AND PATENT APPLICATIONS, INTELLECTUAL

10

PROPERTY RIGHTS.

11

THE FIRST IS IPR MEANS

IT INCLUDES BOTH.

THE SECOND IS IT SAYS IF THAT MIGHT BE

12

ESSENTIAL, AND THE THIRD IS IT SAYS IF THE PROPOSAL

13

IS ADOPTED.

14
15

SO IT MEANS BEFORE THE FOLKS HAVE SETTLED
ON THE WALL SOCKET.
THE EVIDENCE WILL DEMONSTRATE THAT

16
17

SAMSUNG IGNORED THIS RULE.

IT FILED PATENT

18

APPLICATIONS WHICH WERE KEPT SECRET.
IT THEN WENT TO STANDARDS BODY AND MADE

19
20

PROPOSALS THAT IT THOUGHT WERE COVERED BY ITS

21

PATENTS.

22

"IF YOU HAVE PATENTS OR PATENT APPLICATIONS,

23

DISCLOSE THEM," AND THEY DID NOT.

24
25

IT SAT IN THE ROOM WHEN THE CHAIR SAID,

THE CHRONOLOGY WILL BE UNDISPUTED -- I'M
GOING TO PUT IT ON THE SCREEN NOW -- FOR BOTH OF

481

1

ALREADY HAS THE PERSPECTIVE SET UP AND THE VIEWS IN

2

A WAY THAT YOU CAN SORT OF ADD IN LAVISH DETAIL

3

UPON THEM.

4

Q

5

DOCUMENT, PX 163, TO WHAT DO THEY RELATE?

6

A

7
8

AND WHAT DO THE SKETCHES ON THIS PARTICULAR

THESE ARE SKETCHES OF IPHONE IDEAS.
MR. MCELHINNY:

YOUR HONOR, I WOULD MOVE

PX 163, PLEASE.

9

MR. VERHOEVEN:

NO OBJECTION, YOUR HONOR.

10

THE COURT:

ALL RIGHT.

SO ADMITTED.

11

(WHEREUPON, PLAINTIFF'S EXHIBIT NUMBER

12

163, HAVING BEEN PREVIOUSLY MARKED FOR

13

IDENTIFICATION, WAS ADMITTED INTO

14

EVIDENCE.)

15

BY MR. MCELHINNY:

16

Q

SIR, IF YOU'D OPEN YOUR BINDER TO PX 164.

17

A

YES, I SEE IT.

18

Q

WHAT IS PX 164?

19

A

THE FIRST PAGE IS A SCREEN SHOT OF A

20

DIRECTORY, WHICH IS THE CAD FILE DATABASE.

21

LISTS DATE MODIFIED, WHICH MEANS THE LAST DATE THAT

22

YOU WORKED ON THIS PARTICULAR FILE.

23
24
25

IT

AND ALSO A CODE NAME, A THREAD.
BASICALLY, THAT HELPS YOU FIND IT IN THE DATABASE.
SUBSEQUENT PAGES ARE SCREEN SHOTS OF

482

1

THESE CAD MODELS.

2

Q

3

SOMETHING ABOUT A CAD OUTPUT.

4

WERE REFERRING TO AS A CAD OUTPUT?

5

A

6

SOPHISTICATION.

7

I WOULD CALL CAD OUTPUT.

8

Q

9

DATE OF THESE DRAWINGS?

YOU MENTIONED IN AN EARLIER ANSWER, YOU SAID

YES.

IS THIS WHAT YOU

THERE ARE VARYING DEGREES OF
THIS IS A FAIRLY CRUDE SET OF WHAT

CAN YOU TELL, BY LOOKING AT THE DIRECTORY, THE

10

A

MARCH 15TH, 2006.

11

Q

AND, SIR, DO YOU -- DO YOU WORK WITH THE --

12

LET ME ASK YOU THIS:

13

CAD SYSTEM?

14

A

NO, I DO NOT.

15

Q

WHO DOES THE CAD DRAWINGS AT APPLE?

16

A

WE HAVE A DEDICATED TEAM OF CAD SCULPTORS.

17

THERE ARE A FEW DESIGNERS THAT ARE CAPABLE OF

18

CREATING CAD THEMSELVES, BUT IT'S NOT A

19

REQUIREMENT.

20

DO YOU PERSONALLY OPERATE THE

IN FACT, MOST OF US DON'T.

IT'S -- IT REALLY IS A SKILL THAT YOU

21

NEED TO DEDICATE SIGNIFICANT TIME TO JUST TO

22

UNDERSTAND THE CRAFT OF CAD.

23
24
25

SO WE PREFER OUR DESIGNERS TO BE
THINKING, SO WE HAVE A DEDICATED TEAM FOR THIS.
MR. MCELHINNY:

YOUR HONOR, I WOULD MOVE

483

1

PX 164 INTO EVIDENCE.

2

MR. VERHOEVEN:

3

THE COURT:

4

(WHEREUPON, PLAINTIFF'S EXHIBIT NUMBER

5

164, HAVING BEEN PREVIOUSLY MARKED FOR

6

IDENTIFICATION, WAS ADMITTED INTO

7

EVIDENCE.)

8

Q

SO ADMITTED.

BY MR. MCELHINNY:

9

NO OBJECTION, YOUR HONOR.

SO AFTER CAD MODELS, WHAT COMES NEXT, SIR, IN

10

A DESIGN PROCESS, ASSUMING THAT YOU WERE GOING

11

LINEARLY AS OPPOSED TO JUMPING BACKWARDS?

12

A

13

PURSUE AN IDEA THAT WE SEE IN THE CAD SURFACES IN

14

PHYSICAL FORM, WE MODEL IT, WHICH IS TO CNC,

15

COMPUTER NUMERICALLY CONTROLLED.

IF WE FIND THAT WE AGREE, THAT WE WANT TO

THAT IS THREE OR FIVE MACHINING, WHICH

16
17

ESSENTIALLY CUTS FROM A SOLID BLOCK A PHYSICAL

18

LIKENESS OF WHAT WE BUILD IN CAD.

19

Q

20

THAT AN ACCURATE DESCRIPTION OF THE PROCESS THAT

21

LED TO THE ORIGINAL IPHONE?

22

A

YES.

23

Q

AND IS IT AN ACCURATE DESCRIPTION OF THE

24

PROCESS THAT LED TO THE IPAD?

25

A

THIS PROCESS THAT YOU'VE DESCRIBED FOR US, IS

YES.

484

1

Q

LET'S TALK ABOUT THE IPHONE FOR A MINUTE.

2

WHAT -- IF YOU CAN DESCRIBE IT FOR US,

3

WHAT, IF ANYTHING, WERE YOU TRYING TO ACHIEVE IN

4

DESIGNING THE IPHONE?

5

A

6

BEAUTIFUL OBJECT, SOMETHING THAT WOULD REALLY WOW

7

THE WORLD.

WE -- WE WERE LOOKING FOR A NEW, ORIGINAL, AND

8
9

WE WERE ENTERING A CATEGORY THAT WE'D
NEVER PARTICIPATED IN BEFORE, AND THE CATEGORY THAT

10

WE DID NOT ENJOY.

11

THERE WERE NO CELL PHONES THAT

WE LOVED.

12

SO THIS WAS SOMETHING THAT WE REALLY

13

CARED DEEPLY AND PASSIONATELY ABOUT, PRODUCING

14

SOMETHING FOR OURSELVES.
WE -- AS ALWAYS, WE WANTED TO CREATE

15
16

SOMETHING THAT SEEMED SO, SO WONDERFUL THAT YOU,

17

YOU CAN'T IMAGINE HOW YOU COULD FOLLOW IT.

18

OF COURSE, YOU CAN BECAUSE IF YOU LOOK AT

19

THE HISTORY OF OUR PRODUCTS, WE'VE DONE THAT TIME

20

AND TIME AGAIN.

21

BUT YOU WANT TO CREATE THE SIMPLEST,

22

PUREST MANIFESTATION OF WHAT THAT OBJECT CAN BE,

23

SOMETHING THAT PEOPLE CAN LOVE.

24

Q

25

WORKED ON THE DESIGN OF THE IPHONE?

DO YOU RECALL APPROXIMATELY HOW LONG YOU

485

1

A

I HAVE NO IDEA.

I'D HAVE TO LOOK AT

2

DOCUMENTATION FOR THIS.

3

Q

YEARS?

4

A

I THINK SO.

5

Q

LET ME SHOW YOU PX 165.

BUT IT WAS A LONG TIME.

6

MAY I APPROACH, YOUR HONOR?

7

THE COURT:

8

MR. MCELHINNY:

9

THE WITNESS:

YES.
(HANDING).
THANK YOU.

10

BY MR. MCELHINNY:

11

Q

WHAT IS PX 165, SIR?

12

A

THIS IS ONE OF THE EARLY MODELS THAT WE BUILT

13

ON M68, WHICH WAS A CODE NAME THAT WE USED FOR THE

14

ORIGINAL IPHONE.

15

Q

I'M SORRY.

16

A

THAT'S CORRECT.

17

Q

WHEN YOU SAY "WE BUILT THIS MODEL," WHO ARE

18

YOU TALKING ABOUT?

19

A

20

WOULD INCLUDE THE CAD AND THE MODEL MAKING TEAMS.

21

Q

22

THIS ORIGINAL APPLE WORK?

23

A

24
25

THAT'S M68?

"WE" BEING THE INDUSTRIAL DESIGN GROUP, WHICH

AND IS THIS MODEL THAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT, WAS

ABSOLUTELY, YES.
MR. MCELHINNY:

YOUR HONOR, I WOULD MOVE

EXHIBIT PX 165 INTO EVIDENCE.

486

1
2

MR. VERHOEVEN:

I HAVE A POINT OF

QUESTION.

3

CAN I CONFER WITH COUNSEL?

4

THE COURT:

5

(DISCUSSION OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN

6

YES, GO AHEAD, PLEASE.

COUNSEL.)

7

MR. VERHOEVEN:

SUBJECT TO YOUR HONOR'S

8

RULING, YOUR HONOR'S ALREADY RULED ON THESE

9

DOCUMENTS -- I DON'T KNOW IF WE CAN HAVE A

10

SIDE-BAR, YOUR HONOR.

11

DON'T WAIVE ANYTHING.

12
13

THE COURT:

I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE I

OKAY.

I THOUGHT THIS WAS

WORKED OUT BEFORE THE JURY CAME OUT.

14

LET'S DO THAT.

UNFORTUNATELY, THE

15

MICROPHONE IS NOT WORKING, SO WE'LL HAVE TO

16

MEMORIALIZE IT AFTER.

17

LET'S GO AHEAD.

18

MR. VERHOEVEN:

19

(SIDE-BAR DISCUSSION OFF THE RECORD.)

20

THE COURT:

THAT'S OKAY.

OKAY.

THE -- I UNDERSTAND

21

THAT THE SAME OBJECTION WAS RESERVED, BUT IT'S

22

OVERRULED.

23

THIS IS ADMITTED.

24

(WHEREUPON, PLAINTIFF'S EXHIBIT NUMBER

25

165, HAVING BEEN PREVIOUSLY MARKED FOR

487

1

IDENTIFICATION, WAS ADMITTED INTO

2

EVIDENCE.)

3

THE COURT:

4

MR. MCELHINNY:

5

GO AHEAD.
THANK YOU, YOUR HONOR.

MAY I PUBLISH THIS TO THE JURY?

6

THE COURT:

7

(PAUSE IN PROCEEDINGS.)

8

BY MR. MCELHINNY:

9

Q

GO AHEAD.

MR. STRINGER, LET ME SHOW YOU AN EXHIBIT

10

THAT'S BEEN MARKED AS PX 166 (HANDING).

11

A

YES.

12

Q

WHAT IS THAT DEVICE, SIR?

13

A

THIS IS ALSO AN EARLY IPHONE MODEL, ALSO UNDER

14

ITSELF CODE NAME M68.

15

Q

IS IT THE SAME OR DIFFERENT THAN THE 165?

16

A

SIMILAR, BUT DIFFERENT.

17

Q

OKAY.

18

SIR?

19

A

APPLE PROTO 1015 -- OH, IPOD.

20

Q

AND WHY DOES IT SAY IPOD ON A PROTOTYPE OF AN

21

IPHONE, SIR?

22

A

23

COINED THE TERM "IPHONE" AND WE WANTED TO SEE

24

SOMETHING GRAPHICALLY REPRESENTED ON THE BACK; OR

25

WE WERE TRYING TO DISGUISE ITS IPHONE IDENTITY.

AND WHAT DOES IT SAY ON THE BACK OF IT,

ONE OF TWO REASONS.

EITHER WE HAD NOT YET

1
2
3
CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER

4
5
6
7
8
9

I, THE UNDERSIGNED OFFICIAL COURT
REPORTER OF THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT FOR

10

THE NORTHERN DISTRICT OF CALIFORNIA, 280 SOUTH

11

FIRST STREET, SAN JOSE, CALIFORNIA, DO HEREBY

12

CERTIFY:

13

THAT THE FOREGOING TRANSCRIPT,

14

CERTIFICATE INCLUSIVE, CONSTITUTES A TRUE, FULL AND

15

CORRECT TRANSCRIPT OF MY SHORTHAND NOTES TAKEN AS

16

SUCH OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER OF THE PROCEEDINGS

17

HEREINBEFORE ENTITLED AND REDUCED BY COMPUTER-AIDED

18

TRANSCRIPTION TO THE BEST OF MY ABILITY.

19
20
21
22

/S/
_____________________________
LEE-ANNE SHORTRIDGE, CSR, CRR
CERTIFICATE NUMBER 9595

23
24
25

DATED:

JULY 31, 2012